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Great article, I despise AMP and Google using its monopoly to peddle these lies, and using this position to embrace and extend open web standards. We have seen

Great article, I despise AMP and Google using its monopoly to peddle these lies, and using this position to embrace and extend open web standards. We have seen this pattern from a monopoly before and they are currently being taken to task for this behaviour in the EU. I’m still a bit amazed that the devs who work on this don’t understand what they are doing is squarely on the side of evil but I guess it’s a pay check. A few other things AMP lies about: * Wastes bandwidth downloading content in the background * Wastes battery rendering content in the background * Downloads Google links you haven’t given permission you want to see * You can’t even opt out * Breaks the web url extending it for Google’s own purposes * Copying URLs to send to friends or post online no longer works correctly * Breaks the understanding that the domain you are on is the authority for it’s own content * Traps publishers further inside Google’s web, not the open web.

brainfire 9y ago
Just to be clear, you work for a company that presents itself as "The best way to charge for content." Are you already losing money due to AMP adoption?
- donohoe 9y ago
  I doubt that is relevant (and you make a very wide and sorta non-specific insinuation). You can use/integrate paywalls etc. with AMP.
- dang 9y ago
  It's a serious violation of HN's rules to haul someone's personal details into a thread as ammunition against them. Please don't do this again. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
SimeVidas 9y ago
> Wastes bandwidth downloading content in the background. Wastes battery rendering content in the background. That’s Google Search, not AMP. How much bandwidth does Search use? Is it big enough to be a problem for some users? > Downloads Google links you haven’t given permission you want to see. Google Search can load assets from its own domain, like any other website. The user can use browser extensions to block certain requests. > You can’t even opt out. You mean you can’t opt out of seeing AMP results on Google Search? Well, yes, for obvious reasons. AMP is Google’s product. It would make little sense for them to add such an option. > Breaks the web url extending it for Google’s own purposes. Breaks the understanding that the domain you are on is the authority for it’s own content. Yes, it does. > Copying URLs to send to friends or post online no longer works correctly. It works in iOS Safari and Firefox for Android (and probably other browsers as well), which use the canonical URL when the user shares the page. There is also a Share button in the header of the AMP page. > Traps publishers further inside Google’s web, not the open web. You can say that Google traps publishers, but not that AMP is not the open web. Google AMP Cache is a website on the (open) web.
- nailer 9y ago
  > That’s Google Search, not AMP. That's AMP. AMP prefetches content from AMP sites which must be hosted on google.com. The AMP team, when asked about hosting AMP content outside google.com, mention they can't prefetch from other domains with current tech as a blocker for this.
  - SimeVidas 9y ago
    That’s Google AMP Cache, to be specific, which is used by Google Search. I was pointing out that the (alleged) extra bandwidth and battery use happens then the user visits Google’s website. I’d limit the term AMP to the library and framework for creating AMP pages.
    - tareqak 9y ago
      What term would you give for how Google Search treats AMP pages from regular HTML pages?
      - SquareWheel 9y ago
        That's Google's implementation of the AMP Cache. It acts as a CDN for pages that implement the AMP standard. https://developers.google.com/amp/cache/ https://developers.google.com/amp/cache/
        tareqak 9y ago
        OK, why does Google put AMP pages on Google's implementation of the AMP cache above the carousel in mobile, or add the AMP icon to search results that are AMP pages? If AMP pages are faster than regular HTML pages, then Google Search's ranking algorithm would rank higher these faster pages organically.
        manigandham 9y ago
        The biggest issue is that if search results were actually ranked by speed, sites would already become 100x faster without any of this AMP nonsense.
tootie 9y ago
All of this is implicitly true for native apps as well. Google is in open war with Apple to keep users in the browser.
- wil421 9y ago
  I’d argue google is at war with Facebook and other app developers more so than Apple. Facebook mobile has become a “gateway” to the internet. Most links I click on my newsfeed are webpages opened in the Facebook browser.

brainfire 9y ago

Just to be clear, you work for a company that presents itself as "The best way to charge for content." Are you already losing money due to AMP adoption?

donohoe 9y ago
I doubt that is relevant (and you make a very wide and sorta non-specific insinuation). You can use/integrate paywalls etc. with AMP.
dang 9y ago
It's a serious violation of HN's rules to haul someone's personal details into a thread as ammunition against them. Please don't do this again. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

SimeVidas 9y ago

> Wastes bandwidth downloading content in the background. Wastes battery rendering content in the background. That’s Google Search, not AMP. How much bandwidth does Search use? Is it big enough to be a problem for some users? > Downloads Google links you haven’t given permission you want to see. Google Search can load assets from its own domain, like any other website. The user can use browser extensions to block certain requests. > You can’t even opt out. You mean you can’t opt out of seeing AMP results on Google Search? Well, yes, for obvious reasons. AMP is Google’s product. It would make little sense for them to add such an option. > Breaks the web url extending it for Google’s own purposes. Breaks the understanding that the domain you are on is the authority for it’s own content. Yes, it does. > Copying URLs to send to friends or post online no longer works correctly. It works in iOS Safari and Firefox for Android (and probably other browsers as well), which use the canonical URL when the user shares the page. There is also a Share button in the header of the AMP page. > Traps publishers further inside Google’s web, not the open web. You can say that Google traps publishers, but not that AMP is not the open web. Google AMP Cache is a website on the (open) web.

nailer 9y ago
> That’s Google Search, not AMP. That's AMP. AMP prefetches content from AMP sites which must be hosted on google.com. The AMP team, when asked about hosting AMP content outside google.com, mention they can't prefetch from other domains with current tech as a blocker for this.
- SimeVidas 9y ago
  That’s Google AMP Cache, to be specific, which is used by Google Search. I was pointing out that the (alleged) extra bandwidth and battery use happens then the user visits Google’s website. I’d limit the term AMP to the library and framework for creating AMP pages.
  - tareqak 9y ago
    What term would you give for how Google Search treats AMP pages from regular HTML pages?
    - SquareWheel 9y ago
      That's Google's implementation of the AMP Cache. It acts as a CDN for pages that implement the AMP standard. https://developers.google.com/amp/cache/ https://developers.google.com/amp/cache/
      - tareqak 9y ago
        OK, why does Google put AMP pages on Google's implementation of the AMP cache above the carousel in mobile, or add the AMP icon to search results that are AMP pages? If AMP pages are faster than regular HTML pages, then Google Search's ranking algorithm would rank higher these faster pages organically.
        manigandham 9y ago
        The biggest issue is that if search results were actually ranked by speed, sites would already become 100x faster without any of this AMP nonsense.

tootie 9y ago

All of this is implicitly true for native apps as well. Google is in open war with Apple to keep users in the browser.

wil421 9y ago
I’d argue google is at war with Facebook and other app developers more so than Apple. Facebook mobile has become a “gateway” to the internet. Most links I click on my newsfeed are webpages opened in the Facebook browser.