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I can choose not to buy and take opiates. I can't choose to not be murdered. Murderers are much worse, and prisons better serve their purpose when they're used

I can choose not to buy and take opiates. I can't choose to not be murdered. Murderers are much worse, and prisons better serve their purpose when they're used for murderers and their accomplices than when they're used for white collar crime.

QAPereo 9y ago
Spoken like someone who’s never had major surgery or trauma.
- chk_ur_autism 9y ago
  The ignorance of this comment is absolutely astounding. (not yours, the parent!)
- tuxxy 9y ago
  Exactly. I know some pretty tough guys. One of which took a gunshot wound and barely needed any recovery time. This same guy got in a car accident that ruined his back. After some surgery, he tried to not use opioid pain killers, but he described it as maddening. It's not the pain that brings you issues, it's the constant dull, aching pains that give your life grief. He started taking prescribed opioids for it. When it came time to ween off of them, he said it was like looking into a void where he had two exceptionally clear choices: continue using opioids, or struggle to get off of them. He picked the latter and is opioid free for a few years now. He said it was the hardest thing he's ever done. He's just happy to say that he doesn't need them anymore.
  - datawarrior 9y ago
    When I was 19 I messed my back up very badly on the job. The company tried very hard not to take responsibility for it, going so far as court with dueling doctors. The fact I refused opiods for my pain was used against me, "If it's so bad why aren't you taking the pain medications?" My lawyer told me that if I had taken them I likely would have gotten 50% more int he settlement. I don't regret it though. Addiction is a major problem in my family.
    - jdhawk 9y ago
      So always get the script, then flush them?
      - tomjakubowski 9y ago
        A strategy defeated by a single question under oath: “And were you taking the drugs as prescribed?”
  - QAPereo 9y ago
    I think that future generations may look at how we were forced to deal with pain in much the way we look at pre-anesthesia surgery.
  - specialist 9y ago
    Back pain is somehow more personal, emotional. For me, it’s much harder to ignore, suffer.
perfmode 9y ago
Eh. The scale is not really comparable. People who create systemic problems that are difficult to fix pose a much greater threat to society than people who murder individuals. I'm not saying to go easy on murderers. The opposite: I'm saying that we should take the former even more seriously. Fentanyl is an incredibly potent and addictive drug.
notyourwork 9y ago
I don't understand why this needed to be on a throwaway account?
- grzm 9y ago
  The account you're responding to is over 3 months old, which, while not as old as some, doesn't appear to have been created purely for this conversation. There are quite a few members on HN whose accounts appear to have originally been created as a throwaway that have gone on to use it as their main account. Let's err on the side of giving them the benefit of the doubt.
  - notyourwork 9y ago
    Fair point - I didn't check age.
kolbe 9y ago
It's not a great societal practice that we demand everyone be smart enough to defy medical decree in order to remain safe. I know you 140 IQ antisocial introverts always want to structure society as a kleptocracy for the intelligent, but that would be a shit place to live.
nkrisc 9y ago
White collar crime can do far much more societal damage than a single murderer can. I don't see any reason they both can't share prison.
mikeash 9y ago
Choice is irrelevant unless it’s an informed choice. It’s impossible to make an informed choice when people keep the information from you. These people are responsible for hundreds or thousands of deaths. It’s a little less direct than shooting someone in the face, but it should still be considered mass murder.
Pica_soO 9y ago
Would you like this new kind of aspirin? Its totally worry-free as several neutral studies will tell you? Its relative cheap and has a cool name- PuffThePinkDragon.
mustacheemperor 9y ago
A major part of this scandal is the fact that Insys' bribery led me patients to be misled in their choice, by the doctors they trusted for expert advice.
ryuker16 9y ago
In this case doctors were pushing drugs on patients....for some folks, you can't choose not to be addicted after taking it for a length of time.

QAPereo 9y ago

Spoken like someone who’s never had major surgery or trauma.

chk_ur_autism 9y ago
The ignorance of this comment is absolutely astounding. (not yours, the parent!)
tuxxy 9y ago
Exactly. I know some pretty tough guys. One of which took a gunshot wound and barely needed any recovery time. This same guy got in a car accident that ruined his back. After some surgery, he tried to not use opioid pain killers, but he described it as maddening. It's not the pain that brings you issues, it's the constant dull, aching pains that give your life grief. He started taking prescribed opioids for it. When it came time to ween off of them, he said it was like looking into a void where he had two exceptionally clear choices: continue using opioids, or struggle to get off of them. He picked the latter and is opioid free for a few years now. He said it was the hardest thing he's ever done. He's just happy to say that he doesn't need them anymore.
- datawarrior 9y ago
  When I was 19 I messed my back up very badly on the job. The company tried very hard not to take responsibility for it, going so far as court with dueling doctors. The fact I refused opiods for my pain was used against me, "If it's so bad why aren't you taking the pain medications?" My lawyer told me that if I had taken them I likely would have gotten 50% more int he settlement. I don't regret it though. Addiction is a major problem in my family.
  - jdhawk 9y ago
    So always get the script, then flush them?
    - tomjakubowski 9y ago
      A strategy defeated by a single question under oath: “And were you taking the drugs as prescribed?”
- QAPereo 9y ago
  I think that future generations may look at how we were forced to deal with pain in much the way we look at pre-anesthesia surgery.
- specialist 9y ago
  Back pain is somehow more personal, emotional. For me, it’s much harder to ignore, suffer.

perfmode 9y ago

Eh. The scale is not really comparable. People who create systemic problems that are difficult to fix pose a much greater threat to society than people who murder individuals. I'm not saying to go easy on murderers. The opposite: I'm saying that we should take the former even more seriously. Fentanyl is an incredibly potent and addictive drug.

notyourwork 9y ago

I don't understand why this needed to be on a throwaway account?

grzm 9y ago
The account you're responding to is over 3 months old, which, while not as old as some, doesn't appear to have been created purely for this conversation. There are quite a few members on HN whose accounts appear to have originally been created as a throwaway that have gone on to use it as their main account. Let's err on the side of giving them the benefit of the doubt.
- notyourwork 9y ago
  Fair point - I didn't check age.

kolbe 9y ago

It's not a great societal practice that we demand everyone be smart enough to defy medical decree in order to remain safe. I know you 140 IQ antisocial introverts always want to structure society as a kleptocracy for the intelligent, but that would be a shit place to live.

nkrisc 9y ago

White collar crime can do far much more societal damage than a single murderer can. I don't see any reason they both can't share prison.

mikeash 9y ago

Choice is irrelevant unless it’s an informed choice. It’s impossible to make an informed choice when people keep the information from you. These people are responsible for hundreds or thousands of deaths. It’s a little less direct than shooting someone in the face, but it should still be considered mass murder.

Pica_soO 9y ago

Would you like this new kind of aspirin? Its totally worry-free as several neutral studies will tell you? Its relative cheap and has a cool name- PuffThePinkDragon.

mustacheemperor 9y ago

A major part of this scandal is the fact that Insys' bribery led me patients to be misled in their choice, by the doctors they trusted for expert advice.

ryuker16 9y ago

In this case doctors were pushing drugs on patients....for some folks, you can't choose not to be addicted after taking it for a length of time.