4 ms·

I don't think it's just a matter of fashion. Only a handful of the startups we've funded use anything from Microsoft.

by pg 16y ago

evo_9 16y ago
Perhaps then it's more of a mindset issue since .Net is used in a lot of traditional business - aka they already have SQL, Windows Server 2008 and Sharepoint running for example. .Net might just attract personality types that are more risk averse, aka programmers more interested in a steady paycheck than the ups/downs/stress of the startup life.
- ryanhuff 16y ago
  Its multi-faceted issue, partly based on a cultural bias in the Valley of using Unix on the web. There are also lower barriers for developers to pick up lamp, rails, etc than the Microsoft stack, which feeds into it. Hosting is also somewhat cheaper on unix stacks, especially when you add SQL server, which may influence people's choice. Having said this, I find the Microsoft platform dead simple, the tools best of breed, and the new MVC framework to have opened up the platform considerably.
  - evo_9 16y ago
    Good Points. Up until recently I had trouble finding a good/cheap VPS that was comprable to a *nix price. Yeah, the thing people also don't realize on this topic is you can use MS SQL Express - which is free - to avoid paying/licensing issues. The limits are almost entirely around ui, ease of use type features, not performance or scalability. Aka, you don't get the fancy VisualStudio-esq UI so you can't do diagramming, or things that you want generally when you are developing. But you still get a barebones management tool that's better than most of the mySql variants I've played with. For use on a webserver, yeah it's a solid option esp if you are already having to use MS SQL because of other business requirements by your client/company.
viggity 16y ago
If someone applies for YC intending to use MS tech, do you count that as a point against?
- pg 16y ago
  We used to ask on the application what technology people planned to use, but we took that question out. So we wouldn't know in the application stage. At the interview stage it probably wouldn't come up, but if it did the answer would be far outweighed by what we thought of the people and what they'd built. So it might influence us a bit, but we never know till we know other things that influence us a lot more.
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
AmberShah 16y ago
That doesn't discount the idea of fashion. YC attracts a certain crowd of applicants that tend to be younger and more closely tied into the emergent technology trends. If they have the time to take X months off of their jobs and their families, they also probably have time to learn new technologies that they didn't use in school or at work. I'm young enough but with a busy full time job and a toddler, learning new technologies (to the point of extreme proficiency) is not high on my list. For me it came down to what I could build most rapidly given my skillset. I had experience in Java and C#/.NET and my partner (my husband, not my co-founder) could mostly only help in C#/.NET. So it really was a question of getting something built in 3 months versus 6 (or maybe not at all if I got discouraged and it took too long to market). The licensing fees are the things that weigh on my mind, but if my business is successful, I will be able to pay them or even re-write the application using the profits. I know better than to expect to converse about our MS technology with the HN crowd, though.
- cschep 16y ago
  I totally hear this, "using what you know" is really powerful. Be careful here though ... > I know better than to expect to converse about our MS technology with the HN crowd, though. Lots of positive posts, even in this thread!
  - AmberShah 16y ago
    That's true and I think Stack Overflow actually did a lot for making it more acceptable in startupland. And for good reason - if it's good enough for them...
    - rbanffy 16y ago
      The Linux advantage really starts to show when you enter the dozen+ server range. Licenses add up quickly and planning gets more and more complicated. If you run a small group of machines and you know what you are doing, Windows could be just fine for you. The worst that can happen is you succeed and need to migrate your software to another platform. edit: actually the worst that could happen is that you hit a technical problem the closed nature of Windows prevents you from solving and you have to port before you become profitable.
absconditus 16y ago
Your applicants filter themselves quite a bit. The cofounders of the healthcare software company that I work for would never have come to you for instance.
ratsbane 16y ago
At the first Startup School at Harvard someone asked Chris Sacca (who worked for Google at the time) what languages/platforms would help to get you bought by Google. His answer was that pretty much anything was okay... EXCEPT for .Net.

I don't think it's just a matter of fashion. Only a handful of the startups we've funded use anything from Microsoft.

by pg 16y ago

I don't think it's just a matter of fashion. Only a handful of the startups we've funded use anything from Microsoft.

evo_9 16y ago

Perhaps then it's more of a mindset issue since .Net is used in a lot of traditional business - aka they already have SQL, Windows Server 2008 and Sharepoint running for example. .Net might just attract personality types that are more risk averse, aka programmers more interested in a steady paycheck than the ups/downs/stress of the startup life.

ryanhuff 16y ago
Its multi-faceted issue, partly based on a cultural bias in the Valley of using Unix on the web. There are also lower barriers for developers to pick up lamp, rails, etc than the Microsoft stack, which feeds into it. Hosting is also somewhat cheaper on unix stacks, especially when you add SQL server, which may influence people's choice. Having said this, I find the Microsoft platform dead simple, the tools best of breed, and the new MVC framework to have opened up the platform considerably.
- evo_9 16y ago
  Good Points. Up until recently I had trouble finding a good/cheap VPS that was comprable to a *nix price. Yeah, the thing people also don't realize on this topic is you can use MS SQL Express - which is free - to avoid paying/licensing issues. The limits are almost entirely around ui, ease of use type features, not performance or scalability. Aka, you don't get the fancy VisualStudio-esq UI so you can't do diagramming, or things that you want generally when you are developing. But you still get a barebones management tool that's better than most of the mySql variants I've played with. For use on a webserver, yeah it's a solid option esp if you are already having to use MS SQL because of other business requirements by your client/company.

viggity 16y ago

If someone applies for YC intending to use MS tech, do you count that as a point against?

pg 16y ago
We used to ask on the application what technology people planned to use, but we took that question out. So we wouldn't know in the application stage. At the interview stage it probably wouldn't come up, but if it did the answer would be far outweighed by what we thought of the people and what they'd built. So it might influence us a bit, but we never know till we know other things that influence us a lot more.

deleted 16y ago

[deleted]

AmberShah 16y ago

That doesn't discount the idea of fashion. YC attracts a certain crowd of applicants that tend to be younger and more closely tied into the emergent technology trends. If they have the time to take X months off of their jobs and their families, they also probably have time to learn new technologies that they didn't use in school or at work. I'm young enough but with a busy full time job and a toddler, learning new technologies (to the point of extreme proficiency) is not high on my list. For me it came down to what I could build most rapidly given my skillset. I had experience in Java and C#/.NET and my partner (my husband, not my co-founder) could mostly only help in C#/.NET. So it really was a question of getting something built in 3 months versus 6 (or maybe not at all if I got discouraged and it took too long to market). The licensing fees are the things that weigh on my mind, but if my business is successful, I will be able to pay them or even re-write the application using the profits. I know better than to expect to converse about our MS technology with the HN crowd, though.

cschep 16y ago
I totally hear this, "using what you know" is really powerful. Be careful here though ... > I know better than to expect to converse about our MS technology with the HN crowd, though. Lots of positive posts, even in this thread!
- AmberShah 16y ago
  That's true and I think Stack Overflow actually did a lot for making it more acceptable in startupland. And for good reason - if it's good enough for them...
  - rbanffy 16y ago
    The Linux advantage really starts to show when you enter the dozen+ server range. Licenses add up quickly and planning gets more and more complicated. If you run a small group of machines and you know what you are doing, Windows could be just fine for you. The worst that can happen is you succeed and need to migrate your software to another platform. edit: actually the worst that could happen is that you hit a technical problem the closed nature of Windows prevents you from solving and you have to port before you become profitable.

absconditus 16y ago

Your applicants filter themselves quite a bit. The cofounders of the healthcare software company that I work for would never have come to you for instance.

ratsbane 16y ago

At the first Startup School at Harvard someone asked Chris Sacca (who worked for Google at the time) what languages/platforms would help to get you bought by Google. His answer was that pretty much anything was okay... EXCEPT for .Net.