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It seems like the article goes from talking about the reasonable parts of modern liberal belief (LGBT people have the right to exist, racism is still something

• creaghpatr 9y ago
  If you haven't been to a college campus in awhile you would be shocked at the recent gap between 'general' liberal beliefs (legalize pot, gay marriage, increased welfare) and 'post-modern' liberal beliefs, which boil down to increasingly abstract accusations of structural racism/sexism/transism/other isms. That you don't recognize the phrase 'cissexual heteropatriarchy' seems to suggest this, because that's a term that many college administrations recognize, accept, and dole out punishments on, and even questioning that logic will put your education in jeopardy. Basically it's cultural extortion.
  • QAPereo 9y ago
    How about some concrete examples of all of that? If it’s that common you should be able to reference them like crazy. Show me evidence of this growing pattern. Edit: downvote away, but show me the evidence.
    • jimmywanger 9y ago
      The original argument has plenty of examples. Evergreen College wanted a "day of freedom" and forced a biology professor to resign. Just yesterday, a crazy SJW math professor said that math was inherently racist and cisgendered, and bemoaned that the social sciences didn't get as much funding as math. [1] Also, Berkeley and Stanford students complained so loudly and violently that Ben Shapiro and Ann Coulter did not speak (from the article) The search is trivial. [1] http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/23/professor-claims-math-algebra-and-geometry-promote-white-privilege/ http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/23/professor-claims-math-alge...
      • QAPereo 9y ago
        A pattern within something as vast as our higher education system, and that’s it? Followed by the classic deflection of all those without a leg stand on, “find it yourself” to boot? This site has such incredible ups, but the downs are equally staggering and disheartening.
        • imustbeevil 9y ago
          You realize that your posturing, followed by denial of the evidence given to you that doesn't fit the narrative you entered the thread with, is exactly the problem that people are talking about here? I have experienced this first hand in New Jersey, Boston, and Colorado. It seems to me that the only people who don't see a pattern are the people creating the pattern.
          • QAPereo 9y ago
            Asking for evidence commensurate to a claim is posturing? Edit: Claiming that you are right and someone else is wrong because they don't have evidence is posturing. Where did I claim to be right, rather than ask for evidence to support someone else's claim? You seem confused.
            • imustbeevil 9y ago
              Claiming that you are right and someone else is wrong because they don't have evidence is posturing. It means the default in your mind is that you are correct and have to be proven false. There is a pattern because individuals across the country are seeing these things happen first hand. The people in this thread are evidence. Asking for links for every claim is the exact thing the GP was talking about. > You can't reason with postmodernists since they eschew science and evidence-based reason as tools of oppression. You are evidence that this is happening.
              • QAPereo 9y ago
                > You can't reason with postmodernists since they eschew science and evidence-based reason as tools of oppression. You are evidence that this is happening. Even a cursory glance at my posting history would make a mockery of that claim. Drop the empty rhetoric, bring in the evidence.
    • creaghpatr 9y ago
      Just follow New Real Peer Review https://twitter.com/RealPeerReview https://twitter.com/RealPeerReview You don't have to scroll to find headline: Feminist professor finds 'traditional science' is rooted in racism. But you should scroll so you can get a feel for the breadth and depth of this phenomenon. Those abstracts are a hell of a read, if you can wade through it.
    • remarkEon 9y ago
      Just finished grad school at Big State University. Almost weekly both prior and after the election there were rallies and protests (some related to Trump, some not) where the demonstrators would wax on about “systemic white supremacy” and “cisheteropatriarchy”. White students would ceremoniously “acknowledge their privilege” by publicly declaring themselves an ally. They even had someone with an excel tracker to note who was declaring themselves an “ally” (probably collecting emails for future organizing, I would guess). At one of these things, a female student took the mic and talked about the pain she feels for being “white passing”, which I took to mean that people don’t see her as a minority but as White merely because of her skin color - a startling claim. Professors were starting to put “safe space” stickers on their office doors (I have pictures), and people were wearing safety pins after the election to signal that they are a “safe” person to interact with. This is absolutely a cult now, and an increasingly a mainstream one. It’s hard for me to gauge exactly how mainstream it was there but it was localized, it seems, to the undergrad institution.
      • forapurpose 9y ago
        The comment lists several ideas, but doesn't really what the problems are. It just presumes that the problems are self-evident. > "systemic white supremacy” and “cisheteropatriarchy” For example, the idea that there is systemic white supremacy in the U.S. is hard to challenge - the evidence is overwhelming - nor is the proposition that many white people are unaware of it (the 'privilege'). Cisheteropatriarchy means, based just on reading the word here, merely the obvious fact that politics is dominated by heterosexuals whose gender identities are 'near' the stereotypes (i.e., they are not transexual, etc.). It's hard to name anyone in power who doesn't fit that description. I'd love it if we could talk about the ideas, and had some curiosity about them, rather than just dismissing it all as a "cult". > safe spaces That doesn't sound objectionable on its face, and in a society with a lot of racism and sexism, it might be a good idea. I've talked to black people who say they very often feel vulnerable - they never know what someone might do, and if something happens the black person often will get the blame (and be fired, arrested, kicked out of the restaurant, etc.). The Weinstein Company could have used some safe spaces. What harm is it doing?
        • 9y ago
  • qntty 9y ago
    you would be shocked at the recent gap between 'general' liberal beliefs (legalize pot, gay marriage, increased welfare) and 'post-modern' liberal beliefs I have, and I'm not, because this is basically a boogey-man. "Post-modern beliefs" are mostly pretty straight forward criticism that shouldn't be controversial to a thoughtful person. Edit: To be clear, I don't mean that their validity shouldn't be controversial, but that they are a normal part of the debating that is happening all the time in Universities and isn't some sort of intellectual disease. I might not be a libertarian, but I'm not appalled that anyone could believe in libertarianism.
    • angersock 9y ago
      > "Post-modern beliefs" are mostly pretty straight forward criticism that shouldn't be controversial to a thoughtful person. Things like "race and gender are mere cultural constructs", as examples?
      • qntty 9y ago
        It's hard to deny that there is at least some part of our concepts of race and gender that aren't based in biology, but in social patterns. Are they entirely socially constructed? I don't think so.
  • bachmeier 9y ago
    I come to campus five days a week, and have done so for many years, and I never encounter people talking about cissexual heteropatriarchy (never heard of it TBH). Humanities disciplines are about 10% of all professors, and of those, a minority spend their time talking about those things.
  • danielam 9y ago
    Academic ideas often precede cultural and social changes. While the terms in question were previously unknown outside academia and restricted to the postmodern milieu, they are now terms I hear quite often among relatively recent university graduates, even in the software industry. It isn't surprising. After all, one way to influence social changes, good or bad, is by influencing students who then take what they've been taught with them into the broader world. On a related note, you might find Richard Rorty's essay "Universality and Truth" (found in "Rorty and His Critics") interesting. In it, he makes it clear that either you hold to liberal and secular views on the subjects at hand, or you're a “bigoted, homophobic, religious fundamentalist" and therefore ought to be ridiculed (and ought to have your children taught to see you in that light as well). Sadly, this extremist bifurcation of the world seems to be reflected in the unsophisticated politics of our times.
  • peatmoss 9y ago
    What a difference a decade or two makes, isn't it? I started my undergrad in the late nineties at a state university known primarily for liberal arts. The expectation as a liberal / progressive student was that you wrestled with hard, distasteful, nuanced topics. Now, if you teach undergraduate students, you need to weigh whether or not it's worth fending off complaints for not issuing trigger warnings. I have friends who used to teach undergraduate classes, who now avoid doing so because of the aggressive fragility manifested by (some) students. As an avowed progressive, I find this trend really distasteful.
• rayiner 9y ago
  Look how much hate Bernie Sanders—a man who fought for equality his whole life—is getting from the left. He’s being called racist, sexist, etc., and not just by some straw man versions of liberals.
  • praisewhitey 9y ago
    What hate is he getting from the left? I have seen center-left DNC members throw insults his way, but they would very much be on the right of his views (especially economically).
    • rayiner 9y ago
      http://www.npr.org/2015/11/01/453663625/is-it-fair-to-accuse-bernie-sanders-of-sexism http://www.npr.org/2015/11/01/453663625/is-it-fair-to-accuse...
      • linkregister 9y ago
        All that article established was that some undetermined amount of Clinton fanatics accused Sanders of using sexist language for political gain (to promote Clinton’s presidential candidacy). Your previous comment implies the criticism was more widespread and with more breadth.
    • the_gastropod 9y ago
      The term "Bernie Bro" is at least partially used to paint Bernie supporters as misogynistic "bros" as far as I can tell.
      • dragonwriter 9y ago
        Yes, but it's used by his opponents to his right within the Democratic Party as a guilt-by-association attack to make those in the electorate on the left uncomfortable with him, it's not actually an attack from the left.
      • linkregister 9y ago
• WalterSear 9y ago
  I was inundated with that kind of language when I was last in school, a few years ago.
• coffee9 9y ago
  Strange how it's always Communism, seems like a random thing for campuses to pump out so consistently.
  • deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
• alexryan 9y ago
  If you've spent your entire life wiring your brain to fight "oppression", what do you do after the war has been won decisively? It's not easy to rewire your brain. This is especially true when your job depends upon the existence of "oppression" and you have no other marketable skills.
• forapurpose 9y ago
  > reasonable parts of modern liberal belief [vs.] the redpill minefield when they start using extreme examples The things you call "reasonable" were "redpill minefield" to prior generations. Even women working was radical. Segregation was widely accepted. Homosexuality was illegal - nobody was talking about marriage, except probably some college campus radicals. It's a regular pattern: In college, we are open to new ideas and form their beliefs; we challenge the existing orthodoxies and wonder how the older generation can possibly support obvious evils, not understanding they were radical at the time. Then we move on and retain those beliefs: we aren't challenged on our ideas and aren't exposed to new ones, at least not nearly as much and as radically as in college. The new generation goes to college, challenges our settled ideas, and we suddenly are in the position we criticized before: Now, we say, they are going too far. And so change often only happens as fast as generations come and go. Marijuana legalization took waiting for the old generation to die out. Old white people - i.e., the old generation - make up much of the Tea Party (if that's still a thing) and the reactionary GOP. I think the language is off-putting, but that has nothing to do with the value of the ideas (if I read it correctly the meaning of "cissexual heteropatriarchy", which is new to me too, is that politics is dominated by heterosexuals who fit their gender stereotypes (i.e., aren't transsexual, etc.) - really not such a radical thought). I agree the ideas are challenging, but that certainly is not a signal of their value - other than possibly being a positive signal. If we want society to move forward faster than the generational pace, then we can't play the role of the comfortable, older generation - we're going to have to step way outside our comfort zones and into the redpill minefield.
• Chaebixi 9y ago
  > start using extreme examples ("cissexual heteropatriarchy" is a phrase I've literally never heard) Count yourself lucky. Seriously. These people totally exist. For instance: I have an white 20-something acquaintance who posted a photo of a decoration [1] he either made or received that was all full stuff like "In this house we fight cisgendered heteropatriarchy." They are very dogmatic and enthralled by a pseudo-religious ideology complete with devils (e.g. whiteness), saints (e.g. feminism), forms of penitent flagellation, etc. > It seems like that's the real problem now - it's not whether or not these problems exist, or whether they're worth fighting, but rather to what extent they should be fought. Or whether the battle should be led by monomaniacal ideologues. If you can't tell, I'm not one of these people, but I spent a lot of time around them (and am pretty exhausted from it). [1] the decoration was basically a parody of this: https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/House-Rules-Family-Quote-In-This-House-We-Do-Real-We-Forgive-We-Love-Wall-Decal/1424253_32269911205.html https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/House-Rules-Family-...