3 ms·

Could as a consumer not add an arbitration clause to every contract you are handed with the same requirements except you get to pick the arbitrator? It seems st

Could as a consumer not add an arbitration clause to every contract you are handed with the same requirements except you get to pick the arbitrator? It seems strange to me that legally only one side of a contract gets to pick all the niceties. I suppose they would have you arrested for impersonating a lawyer to even ask for this.

stult 9y ago
> I suppose they would have you arrested for impersonating a lawyer to even ask for this. No, in theory anyone can negotiate the terms of their own contracts. > It seems strange to me that legally only one side of a contract gets to pick all the niceties. These are called "contracts of adhesion" (i.e. take it or leave it terms) and are subject to slightly stricter interpretive standards than fully negotiated contracts. It would be impossible for a very large company selling consumer products to have lawyers reviewing every consumer contract because the cost would likely exceed the revenue for each contract, never mind the profits. So it makes sense that it's allowed, though in theory we should be using regulators to ensure that they aren't abused. We don't do that, though, hence the current case. >Could as a consumer not add an arbitration clause to every contract you are handed with the same requirements except you get to pick the arbitrator? Not really. You could manually modify a contract by crossing out terms in pen, but that's only enforceable in cases where the other party also signs the contract. As opposed to most consumer contracts where you sign the boilerplate you are given but the company doesn't then cosign that same copy. In some jurisdictions, even if they sign the same copy, they have to initial the changes for them to be enforceable to stop people from sliding things into a large contract on the sly. But you could certainly try this with a larger personal contract like a car purchase or home rental agreement. I personally do not recommend trying to slide things in without the other party noticing, but it's always worth negotiating if you think they are willing and the modification is worth pursuing.
- mathiasben 9y ago
  I'd like to think it would be possible to create a platform where blocs of consumers could negotiate, examine, modify these contracts of adhesion as a class action.
ifhd 9y ago
How do you do that when it's the install EULA after you've already purchased the product? How do you do that when the contracts are fundamentally entirely one sided (we can change it whenever we want).

stult 9y ago

> I suppose they would have you arrested for impersonating a lawyer to even ask for this. No, in theory anyone can negotiate the terms of their own contracts. > It seems strange to me that legally only one side of a contract gets to pick all the niceties. These are called "contracts of adhesion" (i.e. take it or leave it terms) and are subject to slightly stricter interpretive standards than fully negotiated contracts. It would be impossible for a very large company selling consumer products to have lawyers reviewing every consumer contract because the cost would likely exceed the revenue for each contract, never mind the profits. So it makes sense that it's allowed, though in theory we should be using regulators to ensure that they aren't abused. We don't do that, though, hence the current case. >Could as a consumer not add an arbitration clause to every contract you are handed with the same requirements except you get to pick the arbitrator? Not really. You could manually modify a contract by crossing out terms in pen, but that's only enforceable in cases where the other party also signs the contract. As opposed to most consumer contracts where you sign the boilerplate you are given but the company doesn't then cosign that same copy. In some jurisdictions, even if they sign the same copy, they have to initial the changes for them to be enforceable to stop people from sliding things into a large contract on the sly. But you could certainly try this with a larger personal contract like a car purchase or home rental agreement. I personally do not recommend trying to slide things in without the other party noticing, but it's always worth negotiating if you think they are willing and the modification is worth pursuing.

mathiasben 9y ago
I'd like to think it would be possible to create a platform where blocs of consumers could negotiate, examine, modify these contracts of adhesion as a class action.

ifhd 9y ago

How do you do that when it's the install EULA after you've already purchased the product? How do you do that when the contracts are fundamentally entirely one sided (we can change it whenever we want).