3 ms·

Once you start getting into this type of thinking it's really easy to go down a rabbit hole. I'd love to see the same research, but if you start digging into t

by gxs 9y ago

Once you start getting into this type of thinking it's really easy to go down a rabbit hole. I'd love to see the same research, but if you start digging into this subject you will be disappointed in the answers you get. After researching this stuff as a hobby for some time, I've come to the conclusion that this stuff is not well understood and there is still a lot left to explore. As technical people, we sometimes look for something along the lines of hey - this is the chemical composition of something, balance some equations and figure out the affect it has on our body chemistry. This is just an exmaple, of course it's simplified and not quite accurate. Unfortunately it's not that simple and doing this kind of research requires a ton of data and test subjects that just aren't practical in day to day research.

DarkTree 9y ago
Agreed. When I discovered the world of healthy living, I started reading and applying a lot of nutrition advice to my life. It was natural that I would come across research defending both sides of the coin for certain foods (eggs, for example), but I felt I generally became healthier and more aware of what I put into my body. However, over time I felt I read enough to come to the conclusion that we don't really know much at all and so I don't really read about nutrition research anymore. I tend to stick to simple principles now like eat more vegetables and as little sugar as possible. Beyond that, it seems too nebulous.
- gxs 9y ago
  Exactly, my path was similar and I follow similar principles- lean meats, lots of vegetables, some fat, little to no sugar or processed carbs. Seems like a lot of peopl end up settling into something like this.
will_brown 9y ago
Personally I think the data, if not the studies are readily available, it’s just impossible to have a conversation about diet and nutrition. For example, look at this thread and you would think all you need to do is have 1 person run a treadmill for 1 hour drinking tap water and day 2 repeat the run with coconut water and boom...a legitimate study that “superfoods” are a myth. Continue in this thread and you will note comments, for no reason whatsoever, emphatically stating antioxidants don’t exist. But just to preemptively dissuade a dialogue a suggestion people who believe antioxidants exist also believe their consumption will prevent all cancer...somehow no middle ground exists. Such is my experience discussing diet. I find it’s not just with healthy foods and diets, but one can’t even discuss the correlation of diet and obesity, chronic inflammation, cardio vascular disease, heart disease or diabetes...at least without someone linking to a McDonald’s, Twinkie or ice cream diet where the subject lost weight. In fact I recently had a professor argue with me here on HN that the development of fatty liver disease and type 2 diabetes in children (formerly adult onset diabetes) was unrelated to sugar but rather some mystery variable which hadn’t been discovered because children hadn’t been diagnosed with type 2 diabetes prior to the 1980’s and he ate a ton of sugar growing up in the 70’s. History and entire populace’s of people can serve as the data. Look at the historical diet in Okinawa where they once had the longest life expectancy (but not since the introduction of western diet post WW2) and you will find nutrient/vitamin dense but low calorie foods, foods that are anti-inflammatory, anti-oxidant rich, promote healthy liver and kidney function (detoxification). The concepts are not dissimilar to the Mediterranean diet, which also promotes health and longevity, while the foods themselves are dissimilar. It should come as no surprise that these are the same conclusions you and darktree seem to come to with your own experience, only you are focusing more on the macro side of things. I think what you are finding is you are healthy when you maximizie vitamin/nutrient to calorie intake, remove/minimize refined sugar and carbs (both inflammatory and insulin production triggers). Within that framework you can have foods (diets) as diverse as historical Okinawa and the Mediterranean diet, it just so happens food labeled superfoods also tend to (but not always) fall within the same framework.
- gxs 9y ago
  Have to agree - also adding the bit about needing a lot of test subjects that isn't always feasible if you're doing more targeted analysis - otherwise looking at entire populations over time does offer value. For me personally, nutrition's been categorized along with politics and religion as topics off limits for discussion in social settings unless I know the people I'm chatting with already.

by gxs 9y ago

DarkTree 9y ago

Agreed. When I discovered the world of healthy living, I started reading and applying a lot of nutrition advice to my life. It was natural that I would come across research defending both sides of the coin for certain foods (eggs, for example), but I felt I generally became healthier and more aware of what I put into my body. However, over time I felt I read enough to come to the conclusion that we don't really know much at all and so I don't really read about nutrition research anymore. I tend to stick to simple principles now like eat more vegetables and as little sugar as possible. Beyond that, it seems too nebulous.

gxs 9y ago
Exactly, my path was similar and I follow similar principles- lean meats, lots of vegetables, some fat, little to no sugar or processed carbs. Seems like a lot of peopl end up settling into something like this.

will_brown 9y ago

Personally I think the data, if not the studies are readily available, it’s just impossible to have a conversation about diet and nutrition. For example, look at this thread and you would think all you need to do is have 1 person run a treadmill for 1 hour drinking tap water and day 2 repeat the run with coconut water and boom...a legitimate study that “superfoods” are a myth. Continue in this thread and you will note comments, for no reason whatsoever, emphatically stating antioxidants don’t exist. But just to preemptively dissuade a dialogue a suggestion people who believe antioxidants exist also believe their consumption will prevent all cancer...somehow no middle ground exists. Such is my experience discussing diet. I find it’s not just with healthy foods and diets, but one can’t even discuss the correlation of diet and obesity, chronic inflammation, cardio vascular disease, heart disease or diabetes...at least without someone linking to a McDonald’s, Twinkie or ice cream diet where the subject lost weight. In fact I recently had a professor argue with me here on HN that the development of fatty liver disease and type 2 diabetes in children (formerly adult onset diabetes) was unrelated to sugar but rather some mystery variable which hadn’t been discovered because children hadn’t been diagnosed with type 2 diabetes prior to the 1980’s and he ate a ton of sugar growing up in the 70’s. History and entire populace’s of people can serve as the data. Look at the historical diet in Okinawa where they once had the longest life expectancy (but not since the introduction of western diet post WW2) and you will find nutrient/vitamin dense but low calorie foods, foods that are anti-inflammatory, anti-oxidant rich, promote healthy liver and kidney function (detoxification). The concepts are not dissimilar to the Mediterranean diet, which also promotes health and longevity, while the foods themselves are dissimilar. It should come as no surprise that these are the same conclusions you and darktree seem to come to with your own experience, only you are focusing more on the macro side of things. I think what you are finding is you are healthy when you maximizie vitamin/nutrient to calorie intake, remove/minimize refined sugar and carbs (both inflammatory and insulin production triggers). Within that framework you can have foods (diets) as diverse as historical Okinawa and the Mediterranean diet, it just so happens food labeled superfoods also tend to (but not always) fall within the same framework.

gxs 9y ago
Have to agree - also adding the bit about needing a lot of test subjects that isn't always feasible if you're doing more targeted analysis - otherwise looking at entire populations over time does offer value. For me personally, nutrition's been categorized along with politics and religion as topics off limits for discussion in social settings unless I know the people I'm chatting with already.