5 ms·

Here's the problem I always had with cyronics. You're trusting the future to revive you using future technology. But can you trust it will be for your benefit?

Here's the problem I always had with cyronics. You're trusting the future to revive you using future technology. But can you trust it will be for your benefit? Can you trust the technology will be used ethically? Suppose a theocratic world order identifies you as an enemy of the state, and in an effort at "penance", places your brain into a machine that simulates torture, where not even suicide can bring about escape? A curt reminder that historical "progress" is neither linear nor clearly defined was all I needed to reject the concept. If you assume technology will be fantastic enough one day to revive your perished brain, what holds back the caution that this same technology cannot be used to subject you to inescapable torture? You may view information-specific death as optional now, but one day, it may be outright banished from your set of choices. The world you return to may not afford you the luxury of choosing to die.

teraflop 9y ago
You could make the exact same argument without cryonics. It's possible that tomorrow, the United States will collapse into an evil theocracy that decides to both torture me and devote all of its resources to prolonging my life indefinitely. I could commit suicide today to escape that possibility, but I don't because I judge it to be extremely unlikely.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  > You could make the exact same argument without cryonics. You could, but it would make less sense. > It's possible that tomorrow, the United States will collapse into an evil theocracy that decides to both torture me and devote all of its resources to prolonging my life indefinitely It could, but the information available to most observers makes both the policy transition described unlikely tomorrow, and he technology development improbable in the time necessary to have a meaningful effect even with the policy transition. OTOH, such a policy transition is much more likely between now and whenever the technology to restore life to a frozen cadaver is developed, and at least a large portion of the technology development necessary to effect the extended torture is certain with the ability to revive frozen corpses. The scenarios aren't parallels.
ggreer 9y ago
> If you assume technology will be fantastic enough one day to revive your perished brain, what holds back the caution that this same technology cannot be used to subject you to inescapable torture? This is a sci-fi scenario, not a realistic one. Even so, Alcor has policies in place to prevent it. All five members of the Patient Care Trust Board must be signed up for cryonics, and the majority of them must have a relative or significant other currently cryopreserved.[1] Also, the dewar flasks must be topped-up every few months. If Alcor succumbs to some disaster, the brains will warm up and be destroyed. There's no scenario where evil future archaeologists unearth brains to revive and torture. Again, I must stress how ridiculously implausible this scenario is. Torture requires that a future society expend resources to resurrect some random people from the past, then inflict harm on them. There's no way to profit from those actions. It would require a society that intrinsically valued the torture of strangers. 1. https://www.alcor.org/AboutAlcor/patientcaretrustfund.html https://www.alcor.org/AboutAlcor/patientcaretrustfund.html
jtolmar 9y ago
It makes a much better sci-fi story if the future is an extrapolation of the present. We're not in this moment collapsing into a theocracy so torturing a brain in a jar isn't so punchy. Instead, imagine that a company pays for your revival by writing extreme brand-loyalty onto your psyche.

teraflop 9y ago

You could make the exact same argument without cryonics. It's possible that tomorrow, the United States will collapse into an evil theocracy that decides to both torture me and devote all of its resources to prolonging my life indefinitely. I could commit suicide today to escape that possibility, but I don't because I judge it to be extremely unlikely.

dragonwriter 9y ago
> You could make the exact same argument without cryonics. You could, but it would make less sense. > It's possible that tomorrow, the United States will collapse into an evil theocracy that decides to both torture me and devote all of its resources to prolonging my life indefinitely It could, but the information available to most observers makes both the policy transition described unlikely tomorrow, and he technology development improbable in the time necessary to have a meaningful effect even with the policy transition. OTOH, such a policy transition is much more likely between now and whenever the technology to restore life to a frozen cadaver is developed, and at least a large portion of the technology development necessary to effect the extended torture is certain with the ability to revive frozen corpses. The scenarios aren't parallels.

ggreer 9y ago

> If you assume technology will be fantastic enough one day to revive your perished brain, what holds back the caution that this same technology cannot be used to subject you to inescapable torture? This is a sci-fi scenario, not a realistic one. Even so, Alcor has policies in place to prevent it. All five members of the Patient Care Trust Board must be signed up for cryonics, and the majority of them must have a relative or significant other currently cryopreserved.[1] Also, the dewar flasks must be topped-up every few months. If Alcor succumbs to some disaster, the brains will warm up and be destroyed. There's no scenario where evil future archaeologists unearth brains to revive and torture. Again, I must stress how ridiculously implausible this scenario is. Torture requires that a future society expend resources to resurrect some random people from the past, then inflict harm on them. There's no way to profit from those actions. It would require a society that intrinsically valued the torture of strangers. 1. https://www.alcor.org/AboutAlcor/patientcaretrustfund.html https://www.alcor.org/AboutAlcor/patientcaretrustfund.html

jtolmar 9y ago

It makes a much better sci-fi story if the future is an extrapolation of the present. We're not in this moment collapsing into a theocracy so torturing a brain in a jar isn't so punchy. Instead, imagine that a company pays for your revival by writing extreme brand-loyalty onto your psyche.