4 ms·

Well... there goes your expectation of an increased salary without negotiation. And they did this to improve the gender wage gap? People who don't negotiate wi

Well... there goes your expectation of an increased salary without negotiation. And they did this to improve the gender wage gap? People who don't negotiate will be stuck with their same salary year over year, while those that negotiate will have steadily increasing salaries.

bdcravens 9y ago
I don't see how this is a problem. Those who don't negotiate on a car price probably get a worse than those who do.
kelnos 9y ago
Salary negotiation is a part of life. People need to learn to at least do the minimum amount of negotiation. If you're making $X and a new potential employer offers you $(0.9X), and you just accept it without countering, that's on you. People need to get over the fear that they'll lose their offer if they negotiate. The potential employer has already put in a lot of time (and money) to get to the offer stage; they're not going to rescind the offer just because you ask for more ("That amount isn't going to work for me; I was looking for something more like $(1.1X)"). At worst they'll tell you that they can't go any higher than the original offer, and then the decision is entirely up to you.
- ryandrake 9y ago
  Salary negotiation is like black magic, and simplistic advice of "oh, just negotiate" reminds me of the "Draw the rest of the fucking owl" meme [1]. Every job offer I've ever gotten has been Accept Or GTFO. Asking for more always results in "That's the offer--take it or leave it!" Whoever you captains of industry are who regularly negotiate your salary, let me subscribe to your newsletter, please! 1: https://imgur.com/RadSf https://imgur.com/RadSf
  - kelnos 9y ago
    That's somewhat ironic, as the "draw the rest of the fucking owl meme" is one of my employer's values (which I actually agree with, as long as it's not taken to a ridiculous extreme). "Accept or GTFO" is a risk you run when negotiating. But it's better than just saying nothing and accepting whatever low-ball offer they give you first, and it costs you nothing to at least do a bare minimum of negotiating. It really is as simple as saying "I don't think that amount will work for me; I was looking for something more like $X". I mean it: just that sentence alone. Don't demand or be a dick about it, and don't appear meek as if you're asking for a handout, and don't try to justify it with a "I have mouths to feed" or "I'm saving for a house" or whatever. Just state it, and see what happens. That, or something similar, has gotten me a better offer literally every time I've tried it, and I'm honestly probably an average negotiator, at best. It might not get you exactly $X, but that's what a compromise is: meeting somewhere in the middle.
sidlls 9y ago
How do you figure? I've always negotiated my salary. I've turned down offers that were too low for me. I don't think I've given my salary information to any employer I've been interested in working for. I think maybe the first time I worked with a recruiter I gave it to them, then realized it was a mistake.
dragonwriter 9y ago
> there goes your expectation of an increased salary without negotiation I dunno, since the law requires employees to disclose salary ranges to applicants on request, the rule “apply only if (new position salary) > (current salary)” seems to not require negotiation. OTOH, disclosed ranges from emloyers but no disclosed salary from employees makes salary negotiation a lot easier for employees, too. I don't think the gender wage gap is because women refuse to negotiate, though it's probably at least in part because, in the status quo, they come into it in worse position because of, among other factors, salary history.
s73ver_ 9y ago
The employer is also expected to give a range upon request.

bdcravens 9y ago

I don't see how this is a problem. Those who don't negotiate on a car price probably get a worse than those who do.

kelnos 9y ago

Salary negotiation is a part of life. People need to learn to at least do the minimum amount of negotiation. If you're making $X and a new potential employer offers you $(0.9X), and you just accept it without countering, that's on you. People need to get over the fear that they'll lose their offer if they negotiate. The potential employer has already put in a lot of time (and money) to get to the offer stage; they're not going to rescind the offer just because you ask for more ("That amount isn't going to work for me; I was looking for something more like $(1.1X)"). At worst they'll tell you that they can't go any higher than the original offer, and then the decision is entirely up to you.

ryandrake 9y ago
Salary negotiation is like black magic, and simplistic advice of "oh, just negotiate" reminds me of the "Draw the rest of the fucking owl" meme [1]. Every job offer I've ever gotten has been Accept Or GTFO. Asking for more always results in "That's the offer--take it or leave it!" Whoever you captains of industry are who regularly negotiate your salary, let me subscribe to your newsletter, please! 1: https://imgur.com/RadSf https://imgur.com/RadSf
- kelnos 9y ago
  That's somewhat ironic, as the "draw the rest of the fucking owl meme" is one of my employer's values (which I actually agree with, as long as it's not taken to a ridiculous extreme). "Accept or GTFO" is a risk you run when negotiating. But it's better than just saying nothing and accepting whatever low-ball offer they give you first, and it costs you nothing to at least do a bare minimum of negotiating. It really is as simple as saying "I don't think that amount will work for me; I was looking for something more like $X". I mean it: just that sentence alone. Don't demand or be a dick about it, and don't appear meek as if you're asking for a handout, and don't try to justify it with a "I have mouths to feed" or "I'm saving for a house" or whatever. Just state it, and see what happens. That, or something similar, has gotten me a better offer literally every time I've tried it, and I'm honestly probably an average negotiator, at best. It might not get you exactly $X, but that's what a compromise is: meeting somewhere in the middle.

sidlls 9y ago

How do you figure? I've always negotiated my salary. I've turned down offers that were too low for me. I don't think I've given my salary information to any employer I've been interested in working for. I think maybe the first time I worked with a recruiter I gave it to them, then realized it was a mistake.

dragonwriter 9y ago

> there goes your expectation of an increased salary without negotiation I dunno, since the law requires employees to disclose salary ranges to applicants on request, the rule “apply only if (new position salary) > (current salary)” seems to not require negotiation. OTOH, disclosed ranges from emloyers but no disclosed salary from employees makes salary negotiation a lot easier for employees, too. I don't think the gender wage gap is because women refuse to negotiate, though it's probably at least in part because, in the status quo, they come into it in worse position because of, among other factors, salary history.

s73ver_ 9y ago

The employer is also expected to give a range upon request.