4 ms·

Surely isn't so much an issue of political bias, but the fact they happily helped circulate an ad designed to provoke hatred and fear through clear falsehoods.

by jnty 9y ago

mhneu 9y ago
Thank you - exactly the point. Both inflaming division and lying are bad.
- JumpCrisscross 9y ago
  Moreover, because the ads were narrowly (in terms of ideological cross-section, not numbers) screened, our societal defenses (debunking on the news, the Internet, et cetera) never had a chance to be triggered.
  - mhneu 9y ago
    Yes, the first thing we need is transparency. There's a bill in Congress now to do that. (But that's not ALL we need. Baby steps first though.) http://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/18/facebook-ad-disclosure-bill-243914 http://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/18/facebook-ad-disclos... "McCain signs on to Democrats' Facebook ad disclosure bill"
nindalf 9y ago
> clear falsehoods Its usually not clear whether these ads are based on falsehoods or not. If they're targeted well enough, the intended audience won't report it either. And no, its not enough to evaluate content on the basis of "everyone knows". There are many things that "everyone knows" but are demonstrably false - for example, gun control laws are unlikely to change the number of people who die every year due to firearms. [1] [1] - https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/mass-shootings-are-a-bad-way-to-understand-gun-violence/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/mass-shootings-are-a-ba...
thriftwy 9y ago
What are falsehoods here? Is "in 30 years our country will be changed for worse with global warming unless we change" non-falsehood, while "in 30 years our country will be changed for worse with muslim influx unless we change" falsehood? Say who?
- JumpCrisscross 9y ago
  > What are falsehoods here? >> “French schoolchildren were being trained to fight for the caliphate, jihadi fighters were celebrated at the Arc de Triomphe, and the ‘Mona Lisa’ was covered in a burka” [1]. [1] TFA
  - thriftwy 9y ago
    Isn't that a glimpse in hypothetical future of France? Don't say you can't imagine global warming clip where Arc de Triomphe will be a partially submerged pagoda and Mona Lisa is accessible by gondola and "French schoolchildren were being trained to fight for the caliphate" - I bet some of them already are. Where else ISIS fighters from EU countries come from?
    - lumberjack 9y ago
      > Isn't that a glimpse in hypothetical future of France? No.

Surely isn't so much an issue of political bias, but the fact they happily helped circulate an ad designed to provoke hatred and fear through clear falsehoods.

by jnty 9y ago

Surely isn't so much an issue of political bias, but the fact they happily helped circulate an ad designed to provoke hatred and fear through clear falsehoods.

mhneu 9y ago

Thank you - exactly the point. Both inflaming division and lying are bad.

JumpCrisscross 9y ago
Moreover, because the ads were narrowly (in terms of ideological cross-section, not numbers) screened, our societal defenses (debunking on the news, the Internet, et cetera) never had a chance to be triggered.
- mhneu 9y ago
  Yes, the first thing we need is transparency. There's a bill in Congress now to do that. (But that's not ALL we need. Baby steps first though.) http://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/18/facebook-ad-disclosure-bill-243914 http://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/18/facebook-ad-disclos... "McCain signs on to Democrats' Facebook ad disclosure bill"

nindalf 9y ago

> clear falsehoods Its usually not clear whether these ads are based on falsehoods or not. If they're targeted well enough, the intended audience won't report it either. And no, its not enough to evaluate content on the basis of "everyone knows". There are many things that "everyone knows" but are demonstrably false - for example, gun control laws are unlikely to change the number of people who die every year due to firearms. [1] [1] - https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/mass-shootings-are-a-bad-way-to-understand-gun-violence/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/mass-shootings-are-a-ba...

thriftwy 9y ago

What are falsehoods here? Is "in 30 years our country will be changed for worse with global warming unless we change" non-falsehood, while "in 30 years our country will be changed for worse with muslim influx unless we change" falsehood? Say who?

JumpCrisscross 9y ago
> What are falsehoods here? >> “French schoolchildren were being trained to fight for the caliphate, jihadi fighters were celebrated at the Arc de Triomphe, and the ‘Mona Lisa’ was covered in a burka” [1]. [1] TFA
- thriftwy 9y ago
  Isn't that a glimpse in hypothetical future of France? Don't say you can't imagine global warming clip where Arc de Triomphe will be a partially submerged pagoda and Mona Lisa is accessible by gondola and "French schoolchildren were being trained to fight for the caliphate" - I bet some of them already are. Where else ISIS fighters from EU countries come from?
  - lumberjack 9y ago
    > Isn't that a glimpse in hypothetical future of France? No.