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> If you stole a candy at age 14 from a local store, it is surprise to label you "criminal" at age 35 no? Where is this point coming from? If you got caught st

by sushid 9y ago

> If you stole a candy at age 14 from a local store, it is surprise to label you "criminal" at age 35 no? Where is this point coming from? If you got caught stealing candy at age 14, you're not going to become a convicted felon. NEVER. When you commit an armed robbery, I think it's fair to label someone as a former criminal.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
vkou 9y ago
What about burglary? Grand theft auto? Stealing bikes? Starting a barfight? Serial shoplifting? Downloading a few million documents from JSTOR? Being a street pharmaceutical sales representative? [1] Missing child support payments (Jail time definitely helps with your prospects of making the next payment)? Do all of these brand you with the mark of Cain, for the rest of your life? If so, why do we even let criminals out of prison? Haven't they served their time? [1] One of my acquaintances went from being a drug dealer to a very successful franchise owner (I met him after he made the transition.) Prison wasn't the catalyst for him, but getting shot at by a competitor was. Would we all had been better off if he were shut off from 'good jobs' for the rest of his life?
mulmen 9y ago
I don't think you can reasonably claim that a person who steals candy at age 14 will never be a convicted felon, especially when labels tend to stick with people and influence their later life choices and situation. Where is the benefit to society in labeling someone a criminal for the rest of their lives? Are you arguing that prison ought to have no rehabilitating effect?
btilly 9y ago
However if you are caught at 14 with a naked picture of a 13 year old classmate on your phone, you'll become a convicted sex offender for life. This is not at all hypothetical. I've seen estimates that 1/4 of all convicted sex offenders were themselves minors at the time of conviction, and 14 is the age at which you are most likely to become a registered sex offender. Which will for the rest of your life affect where you live, what jobs you can take, and force you to be registered on a database where your neighbors can see that you're awful but get no useful information about your crime. As a parent of pre-teens I'm far more concerned about them being caught up in this life-destroying lottery than I am about, say, their being kidnapped if they are so unwise as to talk to strangers.
- Clubber 9y ago
  I believe a teen can be convicted of distributing child pornography for sending a picture of themselves to someone. The legal system terrifies me.
donarb 9y ago
How about at 67? A US citizen living overseas is not being told that he can't come to the US because of crimes he committed over 50 years ago. https://www.salon.com/2017/10/16/alvin-queen-american-born-jazz-artist-denied-entry-for-brush-in-with-law-50-years-ago/?ref=hvper.com https://www.salon.com/2017/10/16/alvin-queen-american-born-j...
- bdowling 9y ago
  "Funny thing, I gave up my U.S. passport to make life simpler at tax time." (from linked article) It seems that he renounced his citizenship in order to avoid paying U.S. income taxes, so I don't think you can call him a "US citizen living overseas" anymore.

by sushid 9y ago

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

vkou 9y ago

What about burglary? Grand theft auto? Stealing bikes? Starting a barfight? Serial shoplifting? Downloading a few million documents from JSTOR? Being a street pharmaceutical sales representative? [1] Missing child support payments (Jail time definitely helps with your prospects of making the next payment)? Do all of these brand you with the mark of Cain, for the rest of your life? If so, why do we even let criminals out of prison? Haven't they served their time? [1] One of my acquaintances went from being a drug dealer to a very successful franchise owner (I met him after he made the transition.) Prison wasn't the catalyst for him, but getting shot at by a competitor was. Would we all had been better off if he were shut off from 'good jobs' for the rest of his life?

mulmen 9y ago

I don't think you can reasonably claim that a person who steals candy at age 14 will never be a convicted felon, especially when labels tend to stick with people and influence their later life choices and situation. Where is the benefit to society in labeling someone a criminal for the rest of their lives? Are you arguing that prison ought to have no rehabilitating effect?

btilly 9y ago

However if you are caught at 14 with a naked picture of a 13 year old classmate on your phone, you'll become a convicted sex offender for life. This is not at all hypothetical. I've seen estimates that 1/4 of all convicted sex offenders were themselves minors at the time of conviction, and 14 is the age at which you are most likely to become a registered sex offender. Which will for the rest of your life affect where you live, what jobs you can take, and force you to be registered on a database where your neighbors can see that you're awful but get no useful information about your crime. As a parent of pre-teens I'm far more concerned about them being caught up in this life-destroying lottery than I am about, say, their being kidnapped if they are so unwise as to talk to strangers.

Clubber 9y ago
I believe a teen can be convicted of distributing child pornography for sending a picture of themselves to someone. The legal system terrifies me.

donarb 9y ago

How about at 67? A US citizen living overseas is not being told that he can't come to the US because of crimes he committed over 50 years ago. https://www.salon.com/2017/10/16/alvin-queen-american-born-jazz-artist-denied-entry-for-brush-in-with-law-50-years-ago/?ref=hvper.com https://www.salon.com/2017/10/16/alvin-queen-american-born-j...

bdowling 9y ago
"Funny thing, I gave up my U.S. passport to make life simpler at tax time." (from linked article) It seems that he renounced his citizenship in order to avoid paying U.S. income taxes, so I don't think you can call him a "US citizen living overseas" anymore.