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It's amazing how my gut reactions to Google announcements have changed over the years. Ten years ago: "Google released a new upgrade to X? Sweet! I wonder what

It's amazing how my gut reactions to Google announcements have changed over the years. Ten years ago: "Google released a new upgrade to X? Sweet! I wonder what cool stuff they added!" Today: "Google released a new upgrade to X? Ugh. I wonder what features/workflows they broke or removed." Am I just a cynical jerk, or do other people feel this way too?

CaptSpify 9y ago
That's one of the reasons that I've been moving off of their platforms. I remember when they had light, useful, efficient pages that let you get your work done then move on. They've slowly been moving everything to large, slow, bloated, whitespace-nightmares while removing functionality. If Google was starting as a new company today, there would be no way that I'd use any of their products.
jasonkostempski 9y ago
Ive gone through the same thing except with every product by everyone. I hate to admit it, but im pretty sure thats definition of cynicism.
euyyn 9y ago
I'm biased here, but after Inbox, and after the mobile Calendar apps being upgraded, I was super excited about the web Calendar upgrade. I love it.
- agmcleod 9y ago
  I generally like Inbox as well, feels faster than gmail. Though i've recently gone back to using a local client instead of the web. It's a bit of a change, but just feels simpler to use.
  - yvesmh 9y ago
    The Inbox webapp always worked incredibly slowly for me on Firefox but fast on Chrome. Now I only use the Android app (and only when I need to use the snooze or Trips features) for everything else I use Gmail webapp on Firefox
  - ngrilly 9y ago
    Which local client do you use? Do you download all your emails locally? What about search?
    - agmcleod 9y ago
      Search has been faster than it used to be. I've noticed this in Mail on iOS as well. I use airmail, which i don't think it downloads all emails locally.
- stinky613 9y ago
  I like Inbox, and I use it...but have you noticed that, stunningly, you can search for things in Inbox and get zero results and then take that same search into _gmail_ and get results?? (Unfortunately, no, I don't have an example I can demonstrate extemporaneously)
  - kyrra 9y ago
    Search for emails should be the same between the 2. But I believe Gmail will search other things (like Hangouts chats and maybe other products), while Inbox's search just does email.
    - stinky613 9y ago
      Maybe the search is less different than I think it is. But there are other things... like, am I wrong, or can you still not Mark As Unread in Inbox? Last I checked, you couldn't mark as unread, and if you tried to find out how you'd run into zealots who tell you that your use-case is wrong and that you're using Inbox wrong. So, okay, say I accept that premise; say I accept that there are some things that are just 'the Inbox way' and others are 'the gmail way'. With the click of a button, Gmail lets you save all attachments to Google Drive or download all attachments as a zip--why in the world wouldn't they include that with Inbox? Gmail lets you click an icon in the search bar to reveal advanced search options; if you need to search for something that has an attachment in Inbox you need to either A) google how to do it or B) try to remember "now was it has:attachment? or has-attachment:true? has-attachment:yes?". Is it really so distracting having that little down-arrow icon in the search bar? Also, testing just now I found that the pagination in gmail would let me browse through hundreds of search results going back to 2012 whereas the Inbox endless-page stopped loading additional results by the time I got to email from 2014.
  - area51 9y ago
    This happens to me _everytime_. So frustrating. Is it possible that inbox only searches the literal "inbox" whereas Gmail searches your entire mailbox?
  - kbenson 9y ago
AceJohnny2 9y ago
> Today: "Google released a new upgrade to X? Ugh. I wonder what features/workflows they broke or removed." I think that's inevitable with any product with a bit of history that's accreted features. Microsoft Office? Windows? iPhone? Thinkpad?...
- stinky613 9y ago
  Excel 2016 integrated PowerQuery features and improved upon the data model tools. Going back further, Excel v1 thru v7 was limited to 2^14 rows (16,384); v8 (10yrs after v1) thru v11 upped that to 2^16 rows (65,536); v12 (20yrs after v1) thru current can handle 2^20 rows (1,048,576). Windows 10 is faster and more secure than any consumer version of Windows ever released; PowerShell (slow to start up and verbose, though it may be) makes CMD.exe look like a kid's toy; Win8.1 added the Win+X menu, a ridiculously useful shortcut for our crowd; and the Windows Reset feature--show me a tech that doesn't love having that baked-in. We also have the (not perfect but still better than nothing) Windows Subsystem for Linux. And we have improved container support on the horizon. iPhone: SecureEnclave, TouchID, ApplePay, waterproofing; and they continue to try to improve security and privacy. EDIT: Corrected 2^14 = 16,374; not 65,536 as I had originally written. Credit to unwind for the correction.
  - unwind 9y ago
    2^14 is not 65536, it's just 16384.
    - stinky613 9y ago
      D'oh! Right you are!
revelation 9y ago
No. The biggest case in point is just Google Groups. It feels like they just let the interns go "fuck my shit up" over there.
TeMPOraL 9y ago
If you're just a cynical jerk, then you're not alone. I feel similarly. Even worse, my reaction these days is "I wonder what new way they have to make even less useful information be displayed on the screen, while making the product even more bloated and unusable on anything but most trivial datasets".
- escherize 9y ago
  While siphoning up more user data.
ProAm 9y ago
I fully agree with you. When they try to iterate on a basic utility application (ex: email, calendar, reminders, etc..) just because they have a bored developer that is looking to be noticed inside of google they usually make it less useful for people who have been using it successfully for years. Those users are now having to find an alternative to do the same thing. Sometimes it's OK to leave a wrench as a wrench.
gtf21 9y ago
My immediate reaction was: "oh god eyecandy + broken features". I felt the same way with Inbox (which, thankfully, was not pressed onto users). They seem to make cosmetic changes (IMO material-UI is clunky) which in turn make things harder to use, or they just straight-up remove stuff on which one relied previously.
- kingnothing 9y ago
  I actually thought Inbox was a refreshing change for email management, particularly snoozing, but I wish they would port the rest of gmail to it. It's a horrible UX to have to switch from Inbox to gmail to manage filters and anything else that even remotely caters to a "power user".
KGIII 9y ago
There's no need to be a cynical jerk... ...they are just going to cancel it a few years from now.
sidcool 9y ago
I have been using this new calendar as a beta tester and honestly I loved it. It's not world changing, but makes some routine tasks simpler.
yegle 9y ago
I think Calendar web is the first major product update from Google that gets nothing broken/left out compare to the old version. I happily accepted the new version without trying to find the "switch back to old version" link. Mind you, we heavily rely on calendar's web UI internally. The calendar team did a great job to make sure you won't miss any feature from the old web UI. Disclaimer I work for Google on unrelated project.
signal11 9y ago
I do have a problem with Google Calendar's feature-set, however they did fix one of my problems in the past-- no "month view" in the iOS app.

CaptSpify 9y ago

That's one of the reasons that I've been moving off of their platforms. I remember when they had light, useful, efficient pages that let you get your work done then move on. They've slowly been moving everything to large, slow, bloated, whitespace-nightmares while removing functionality. If Google was starting as a new company today, there would be no way that I'd use any of their products.

jasonkostempski 9y ago

Ive gone through the same thing except with every product by everyone. I hate to admit it, but im pretty sure thats definition of cynicism.

euyyn 9y ago

I'm biased here, but after Inbox, and after the mobile Calendar apps being upgraded, I was super excited about the web Calendar upgrade. I love it.

agmcleod 9y ago
I generally like Inbox as well, feels faster than gmail. Though i've recently gone back to using a local client instead of the web. It's a bit of a change, but just feels simpler to use.
- yvesmh 9y ago
  The Inbox webapp always worked incredibly slowly for me on Firefox but fast on Chrome. Now I only use the Android app (and only when I need to use the snooze or Trips features) for everything else I use Gmail webapp on Firefox
- ngrilly 9y ago
  Which local client do you use? Do you download all your emails locally? What about search?
  - agmcleod 9y ago
    Search has been faster than it used to be. I've noticed this in Mail on iOS as well. I use airmail, which i don't think it downloads all emails locally.
stinky613 9y ago
I like Inbox, and I use it...but have you noticed that, stunningly, you can search for things in Inbox and get zero results and then take that same search into _gmail_ and get results?? (Unfortunately, no, I don't have an example I can demonstrate extemporaneously)
- kyrra 9y ago
  Search for emails should be the same between the 2. But I believe Gmail will search other things (like Hangouts chats and maybe other products), while Inbox's search just does email.
  - stinky613 9y ago
    Maybe the search is less different than I think it is. But there are other things... like, am I wrong, or can you still not Mark As Unread in Inbox? Last I checked, you couldn't mark as unread, and if you tried to find out how you'd run into zealots who tell you that your use-case is wrong and that you're using Inbox wrong. So, okay, say I accept that premise; say I accept that there are some things that are just 'the Inbox way' and others are 'the gmail way'. With the click of a button, Gmail lets you save all attachments to Google Drive or download all attachments as a zip--why in the world wouldn't they include that with Inbox? Gmail lets you click an icon in the search bar to reveal advanced search options; if you need to search for something that has an attachment in Inbox you need to either A) google how to do it or B) try to remember "now was it has:attachment? or has-attachment:true? has-attachment:yes?". Is it really so distracting having that little down-arrow icon in the search bar? Also, testing just now I found that the pagination in gmail would let me browse through hundreds of search results going back to 2012 whereas the Inbox endless-page stopped loading additional results by the time I got to email from 2014.
- area51 9y ago
  This happens to me _everytime_. So frustrating. Is it possible that inbox only searches the literal "inbox" whereas Gmail searches your entire mailbox?
- kbenson 9y ago

AceJohnny2 9y ago

> Today: "Google released a new upgrade to X? Ugh. I wonder what features/workflows they broke or removed." I think that's inevitable with any product with a bit of history that's accreted features. Microsoft Office? Windows? iPhone? Thinkpad?...

stinky613 9y ago
Excel 2016 integrated PowerQuery features and improved upon the data model tools. Going back further, Excel v1 thru v7 was limited to 2^14 rows (16,384); v8 (10yrs after v1) thru v11 upped that to 2^16 rows (65,536); v12 (20yrs after v1) thru current can handle 2^20 rows (1,048,576). Windows 10 is faster and more secure than any consumer version of Windows ever released; PowerShell (slow to start up and verbose, though it may be) makes CMD.exe look like a kid's toy; Win8.1 added the Win+X menu, a ridiculously useful shortcut for our crowd; and the Windows Reset feature--show me a tech that doesn't love having that baked-in. We also have the (not perfect but still better than nothing) Windows Subsystem for Linux. And we have improved container support on the horizon. iPhone: SecureEnclave, TouchID, ApplePay, waterproofing; and they continue to try to improve security and privacy. EDIT: Corrected 2^14 = 16,374; not 65,536 as I had originally written. Credit to unwind for the correction.
- unwind 9y ago
  2^14 is not 65536, it's just 16384.
  - stinky613 9y ago
    D'oh! Right you are!

revelation 9y ago

No. The biggest case in point is just Google Groups. It feels like they just let the interns go "fuck my shit up" over there.

TeMPOraL 9y ago

If you're just a cynical jerk, then you're not alone. I feel similarly. Even worse, my reaction these days is "I wonder what new way they have to make even less useful information be displayed on the screen, while making the product even more bloated and unusable on anything but most trivial datasets".

escherize 9y ago
While siphoning up more user data.

ProAm 9y ago

I fully agree with you. When they try to iterate on a basic utility application (ex: email, calendar, reminders, etc..) just because they have a bored developer that is looking to be noticed inside of google they usually make it less useful for people who have been using it successfully for years. Those users are now having to find an alternative to do the same thing. Sometimes it's OK to leave a wrench as a wrench.

gtf21 9y ago

My immediate reaction was: "oh god eyecandy + broken features". I felt the same way with Inbox (which, thankfully, was not pressed onto users). They seem to make cosmetic changes (IMO material-UI is clunky) which in turn make things harder to use, or they just straight-up remove stuff on which one relied previously.

kingnothing 9y ago
I actually thought Inbox was a refreshing change for email management, particularly snoozing, but I wish they would port the rest of gmail to it. It's a horrible UX to have to switch from Inbox to gmail to manage filters and anything else that even remotely caters to a "power user".

KGIII 9y ago

There's no need to be a cynical jerk... ...they are just going to cancel it a few years from now.

sidcool 9y ago

I have been using this new calendar as a beta tester and honestly I loved it. It's not world changing, but makes some routine tasks simpler.

yegle 9y ago

I think Calendar web is the first major product update from Google that gets nothing broken/left out compare to the old version. I happily accepted the new version without trying to find the "switch back to old version" link. Mind you, we heavily rely on calendar's web UI internally. The calendar team did a great job to make sure you won't miss any feature from the old web UI. Disclaimer I work for Google on unrelated project.

signal11 9y ago

I do have a problem with Google Calendar's feature-set, however they did fix one of my problems in the past-- no "month view" in the iOS app.