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If North Korea is so poor, how can they afford nuclear weapons, ballistic missles and skilled hackers? In the long-term, an impoverished population would make

If North Korea is so poor, how can they afford nuclear weapons, ballistic missles and skilled hackers? In the long-term, an impoverished population would make it harder, not easier. Are they not as poor as reported; or are they supplied by another?

icpmacdo 9y ago
First two paragraphs "When North Korean hackers tried to steal $1 billion from the New York Federal Reserve last year, only a spelling error stopped them. They were digitally looting an account of the Bangladesh Central Bank, when bankers grew suspicious about a withdrawal request that had misspelled “foundation” as “fandation.” Even so, Kim Jong-un’s minions still got away with $81 million in that heist"
- malloryerik 9y ago
  Exactly, and I wonder how much they made from WannaCry. http://www.ibtimes.co.in/north-korea-behind-deadly-wannacry-ransomware-attack-microsoft-745664 http://www.ibtimes.co.in/north-korea-behind-deadly-wannacry-... Also we should remember that North Korean hackers don't receive Silicon Valley salaries; whatever remuneration they receive is purely at the pleasure of the palace.
  - monocasa 9y ago
    Well, the NSA is behind the exploit. They're the ones who were sitting on the 0day that got leaked.
- fellellor 9y ago
  That's only 81 million revenue. The profit might be much smaller. The resources to Spy on the bank officials and creating the malware that style the credentials would certainly not have been free.
malloryerik 9y ago
It's still a country of 25 million, and the state technically owns everything. The internet units most likely pay for themselves and then some, since much of their activity is theft.
synicalx 9y ago
They are very poor, and have gotten poorer since the last round of sanctions went through. However when you chose to build rockets rather than feed people, you can make your dollar stretch a bit further.
- malloryerik 9y ago
  Actually North Korea has been growing economically, and rather substantially. The latest sanctions may change some of that. EDIT: Much of that growth is (or was) due to limited market liberalization, the "jangmadang" or local marketplaces, tolerated since the famines of the 1990's, then more or less officially acknowledged. Trade with China is involved here. https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-northkorea-economy-gdp/north-korea-2016-economic-growth-at-17-year-high-despite-sanctions-south-korea-idUKKBN1A6083 https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-northkorea-economy-gdp/no...
  - synicalx 9y ago
    Interesting, I knew their economy had picked up a bit what I wasn't aware of the extent, thanks for the link.
boomboomsubban 9y ago
Roughly 25% of their GDP is spent on military spending. Military first is the official policy, likely due to the whole invasion problems they had in the 20th century.
- blazespin 9y ago
  Yeah, that and other nation building going around last few decades (iraq, libya, etc) You reap what you sow, I guess.
tryingagainbro 9y ago
Because they put the military before anything else. They're still a nation state, and have enough funds to buy things (know-how included) in the black market. Hacking apparently pays for itself and then some. I'm certain they're not paying them $150,000 a year plus 401K benefits.
- wallace_f 9y ago
  >and have enough funds to buy things. Yea but the real answer is opportunity cost. When it is a gun to your head between physical labor, or winning favor with the guy with the guns, it's an easy decision. In other words, they dont need money to motivate you because your opportunity cost is so miserable. And even if they didn't pay for themselves, all an IT worker neess is a computer and internet connection. Look at some of the most talented black hat hackers, Barnaby Jack was just a guy with no education hanging out on welfare with a computer. Sabu was just a drug dealer living in the projects. Jeremy Hammond was a PC repairman that liked to go to political protests. We're kidding ourselves that to be a good engineer (or anything for that matter) you need to somehow be "high class," have branded credentials, and come with an expensive salary.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - hyperpallium 9y ago
    I was thinking also that ingenuity requires freedom (or, is greatly facilitated by it). (Those examples happen to be people with more latitute than most.)

icpmacdo 9y ago

First two paragraphs "When North Korean hackers tried to steal $1 billion from the New York Federal Reserve last year, only a spelling error stopped them. They were digitally looting an account of the Bangladesh Central Bank, when bankers grew suspicious about a withdrawal request that had misspelled “foundation” as “fandation.” Even so, Kim Jong-un’s minions still got away with $81 million in that heist"

malloryerik 9y ago
Exactly, and I wonder how much they made from WannaCry. http://www.ibtimes.co.in/north-korea-behind-deadly-wannacry-ransomware-attack-microsoft-745664 http://www.ibtimes.co.in/north-korea-behind-deadly-wannacry-... Also we should remember that North Korean hackers don't receive Silicon Valley salaries; whatever remuneration they receive is purely at the pleasure of the palace.
- monocasa 9y ago
  Well, the NSA is behind the exploit. They're the ones who were sitting on the 0day that got leaked.
fellellor 9y ago
That's only 81 million revenue. The profit might be much smaller. The resources to Spy on the bank officials and creating the malware that style the credentials would certainly not have been free.

malloryerik 9y ago

It's still a country of 25 million, and the state technically owns everything. The internet units most likely pay for themselves and then some, since much of their activity is theft.

synicalx 9y ago

They are very poor, and have gotten poorer since the last round of sanctions went through. However when you chose to build rockets rather than feed people, you can make your dollar stretch a bit further.

malloryerik 9y ago
Actually North Korea has been growing economically, and rather substantially. The latest sanctions may change some of that. EDIT: Much of that growth is (or was) due to limited market liberalization, the "jangmadang" or local marketplaces, tolerated since the famines of the 1990's, then more or less officially acknowledged. Trade with China is involved here. https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-northkorea-economy-gdp/north-korea-2016-economic-growth-at-17-year-high-despite-sanctions-south-korea-idUKKBN1A6083 https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-northkorea-economy-gdp/no...
- synicalx 9y ago
  Interesting, I knew their economy had picked up a bit what I wasn't aware of the extent, thanks for the link.

boomboomsubban 9y ago

Roughly 25% of their GDP is spent on military spending. Military first is the official policy, likely due to the whole invasion problems they had in the 20th century.

blazespin 9y ago
Yeah, that and other nation building going around last few decades (iraq, libya, etc) You reap what you sow, I guess.

tryingagainbro 9y ago

Because they put the military before anything else. They're still a nation state, and have enough funds to buy things (know-how included) in the black market. Hacking apparently pays for itself and then some. I'm certain they're not paying them $150,000 a year plus 401K benefits.

wallace_f 9y ago
>and have enough funds to buy things. Yea but the real answer is opportunity cost. When it is a gun to your head between physical labor, or winning favor with the guy with the guns, it's an easy decision. In other words, they dont need money to motivate you because your opportunity cost is so miserable. And even if they didn't pay for themselves, all an IT worker neess is a computer and internet connection. Look at some of the most talented black hat hackers, Barnaby Jack was just a guy with no education hanging out on welfare with a computer. Sabu was just a drug dealer living in the projects. Jeremy Hammond was a PC repairman that liked to go to political protests. We're kidding ourselves that to be a good engineer (or anything for that matter) you need to somehow be "high class," have branded credentials, and come with an expensive salary.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- hyperpallium 9y ago
  I was thinking also that ingenuity requires freedom (or, is greatly facilitated by it). (Those examples happen to be people with more latitute than most.)