5 ms·

Part of the challenge is all of the invisible costs of cars. Repairs & maintenance & tires are usually just as much as gas, but nobody thinks about that. Road m

Part of the challenge is all of the invisible costs of cars. Repairs & maintenance & tires are usually just as much as gas, but nobody thinks about that. Road maintenance for the city is stupid expensive, parking lots are too. But it's all magicked behind the curtain. Whereas, with public transit, far more of the costs are represented by the fare.

colechristensen 9y ago
For me, over the last 80,000 miles, about 85% of the operating costs were gas. I did think about that, and I have. I briefly considered getting rid of my car to eliminate the cost of insurance and renting a parking space while working from home. It was at best break even to match my then current behavior with public transit and taxi-equivalents. It seems about 40% of Caltrain is not covered by fares. It's hard to find numbers, but it seems like as well something in the neighborhood of half of road costs are covered by gas taxes. I'm trying to make the point that these costs aren't hidden and don't come from magic places, they seem to be real and Caltrain seems to be very inefficient compared to what one would expect. One would expect a train capable of carrying hundreds of people would be orders of magnitude less expensive instead of being more or less at parity with one car per person.
- goialoq 9y ago
  The most expensive Caltrain pass is <$5K/yr. A small car that drives anywhere near that distance will cost >$5K/yr total cost of ownership, especially is parking is unsubsidized. http://www.caltrain.com/Fares/farechart.html http://www.caltrain.com/Fares/farechart.html https://www.edmunds.com/toyota/corolla/2017/st-401668011/cost-to-own/ https://www.edmunds.com/toyota/corolla/2017/st-401668011/cos...
  - DrScump 9y ago
    A small car that drives anywhere near that distance will cost >$5K/yr A brand-new, name brand small car
    - upvotinglurker 9y ago
      What cars are not name brand? (Self-built?)
      - DrScump 9y ago
        People of modest means will more typically be driving used cars.
        upvotinglurker 9y ago
        Yes, but the Toyota I bought used was still a Toyota.
- sliverstorm 9y ago
  It sounds like maybe you included this in your calcs, but I forgot to add depreciation as another cost. And the most magicky auto costs are the ones hidden a few layers deep, in our city design & abundance of parking for example.

colechristensen 9y ago

For me, over the last 80,000 miles, about 85% of the operating costs were gas. I did think about that, and I have. I briefly considered getting rid of my car to eliminate the cost of insurance and renting a parking space while working from home. It was at best break even to match my then current behavior with public transit and taxi-equivalents. It seems about 40% of Caltrain is not covered by fares. It's hard to find numbers, but it seems like as well something in the neighborhood of half of road costs are covered by gas taxes. I'm trying to make the point that these costs aren't hidden and don't come from magic places, they seem to be real and Caltrain seems to be very inefficient compared to what one would expect. One would expect a train capable of carrying hundreds of people would be orders of magnitude less expensive instead of being more or less at parity with one car per person.

goialoq 9y ago
The most expensive Caltrain pass is <$5K/yr. A small car that drives anywhere near that distance will cost >$5K/yr total cost of ownership, especially is parking is unsubsidized. http://www.caltrain.com/Fares/farechart.html http://www.caltrain.com/Fares/farechart.html https://www.edmunds.com/toyota/corolla/2017/st-401668011/cost-to-own/ https://www.edmunds.com/toyota/corolla/2017/st-401668011/cos...
- DrScump 9y ago
  A small car that drives anywhere near that distance will cost >$5K/yr A brand-new, name brand small car
  - upvotinglurker 9y ago
    What cars are not name brand? (Self-built?)
    - DrScump 9y ago
      People of modest means will more typically be driving used cars.
      - upvotinglurker 9y ago
        Yes, but the Toyota I bought used was still a Toyota.
sliverstorm 9y ago
It sounds like maybe you included this in your calcs, but I forgot to add depreciation as another cost. And the most magicky auto costs are the ones hidden a few layers deep, in our city design & abundance of parking for example.