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> Once in a while, these folks bump in to terrible projects and whatever they prescribed sometime works like a charm Not always true. For example Extreme Progr
by olavk 9y ago
> Once in a while, these folks bump in to terrible projects and whatever they prescribed sometime works like a charm
Not always true. For example Extreme Programming actually originated from an effort to save a large software system in trouble (a payroll management system for Chrysler). But in this case the prescription didn't work and the project was never completed.
It is pretty impressive to be able to sell a methodology on this background.
- k__ 9y agoI read that the main selling point of XP is "a group of highly skilled people doing their thing" Which only works as long as you got highly skilled people to start with.
- Silhouette 9y agoWhich only works as long as you got highly skilled people to start with. Moreover, I would argue that almost anything you put down on paper as the development process can work if you've got an interested team of skilled people. Such a team will naturally adapt and adjust until they've got something effective, if necessary to the point that the original on-paper idea has all but disappeared if it wasn't helping. That's also essentially the first point of the original Agile Manifesto, though of course it's been happening since long before anyone ever wrote it down and gave it a name.
- raarts 9y agoYou're not wrong, but all those software methodologies aren't meant for the teams of very good developers, because they don't need them, but for the large majority of mediocre programmers who need to be herded.
- Silhouette 9y agoRight, so the effectiveness of any particular methodology when applied by a team of very good developers isn't particularly useful information. What would be more useful is knowing whether the same methodology brings significantly better results when adopted by a team of average developers when compared to whatever they were doing before. I'm agreeing with k__ here.
- Nuzzerino 9y agoIt's not so black and white like that. You could have very good developers on a team with a mediocre "scrum master" or manager, who could conceivably become less productive because of it, despite best efforts to make it work. You can disagree, but I've seen it first-hand.
- Silhouette 9y agoA bad manager can typically do far more damage than any individual member of a team, but IME it's unlikely that people who are good are going to stick around for long if they're being managed by a moron, whatever that moron's oh-so-trendy job title may be. A team of developers good enough to figure out a working process for any given job without management holding their hands has plenty of better options. That aside, surely the more interesting scenario is still the reverse of the one you described: can good management leading average developers get better results from those developers by adopting certain working practices?
- k__ 9y agoI think the problem is if you got a mixed bag. part of the team needs it, the rest is going crazy because of it...