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I thought it was common knowledge that support for Nazis in America was widespread all the way leading to American involvement in WW2. Here's another sample: h

I thought it was common knowledge that support for Nazis in America was widespread all the way leading to American involvement in WW2. Here's another sample: http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-ross-nazis-of-los-angeles-hitler-in-la-20171008-story.html http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-ross-nazis-of-los... What Lewis did not anticipate is that local authorities would prove indifferent to — or supportive of — the Nazis and fascists. Within weeks of going undercover, Lewis’ network of spies discovered a plot to wrest control of armories in San Francisco, L.A. and San Diego — part of a larger plan to take over local governments and carry out a mass execution of Jews. Lewis immediately informed L.A. Police Chief James Edgar “Two-Gun” Davis of the Nazi scheme to seize weapons and, as Lewis warned in a memo later, to “foster a fascist form of government in the United States.” Lewis was shocked when Davis interrupted him to defend Hitler. The police chief, he noted in the memo, told him: “Germans could not compete economically with the Jews in Germany and had been forced to take the action they did.” The greatest danger the city faced, Davis insisted, was not from Nazis but from communists living in the heavily Jewish neighborhood of Boyle Heights. As far as Davis was concerned, every communist was a Jew and every Jew a communist.

flachsechs 9y ago
if every white american spent a week as another race, i don't think a single one would be 'shocked' or 'flabbergasted' about any of this.
- js2 9y ago
  http://galactanet.com/oneoff/theegg_mod.html http://galactanet.com/oneoff/theegg_mod.html
- kevmo 9y ago
  I wish "Black Like Me" were mandatory reading in public schools: Black Like Me, first published in 1961, is a nonfiction book by white journalist John Howard Griffin recounting his journey in the Deep South of the United States, at a time when African-Americans lived under Racial Segregation. Griffin was a native of Dallas, Texas, who had his skin temporarily darkened to pass as a black man. He traveled for six weeks throughout the racially segregated states of Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Arkansas, and Georgia to explore life from the other side of the color line. It's short and fascinating. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Like_Me https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Like_Me
  - ibn_ibid 9y ago
    or...you could read something written by an actual black person?
- merpnderp 9y ago
  Did you just "white privilege" and undercover citizen trying to expose Nazi's ~80 years ago because he was shocked at how widespread support was? Your point is that if he'd been black he wouldn't have been shocked by Nazi support?
  - flachsechs 9y ago
    i didn't make any of those points, but you just did, and then ascribed them to me, which is pretty typical of online discussions. it's called a straw-man argument. the reason it's so widespread is it's so easy to do. all you have to do is come up with a bunch of stuff you dislike, and then accuse me of being/doing that stuff. and there's nothing i can really do about it, because these ideas exist only in your head, not mine.
  - ZeroGravitas 9y ago
    Well, I find it unlikely that a Chinese, Mexican or African-American would have been surprised that a high ranking law enforcement officer was openly supportive of the people terrorising their communities in those days. To be honest I'm a little surprised that a Jewish person would be that naive either, particularly a lawyer that helped found the ADL.
  - okreallywtf 9y ago
    Do you disagree that being white, on average, causes one to be less exposed to racism? I don't think that is a particularly radical concept. I also think that being a male, on average, causes one to be less directly exposed to cat-calling and other everyday-sexism. Do you take offense at my suggestion of male privilege?
    - merpnderp 9y ago
      On average? You going to measure that in a lab and show me your margin of error, or is this now a political discussion? And "male privilege" is dumb. Measure it - show me your science. Otherwise I'll think about how many men die on the job versus women, how women receive more lenient sentences for the same crime, or how women now receive the majority of degrees, and a women who never has kids or marries, will make significantly more money over her life than a similar man, and I think "Weird, it's like biology strangely enough, affects our culture in all sorts of crazy ways that having nothing to do with some nut job conspiracy theory about male patriarchy."
- cabaalis 9y ago
  You're on this site, so I hope you recognize the stereotyping and assumptions of character in your statement. I am white, ~25% Filipino also, but light skinned so historically I have been taken as a white male. I'm not shocked or flabbergasted at all by this because I am an American and part of our laws that we hold very dear allows us to publicly espouse views that are repugnant. I heard the speaker saying terrible things about Jews, which no thinking person would ever support. I did not hear him inciting or suggesting attacks against them though, which would be illegal. At one point someone tried to rush the stage, though we don't know his motivations. That person was beaten, which should have resulted in the arrests of everyone involved. Other than that, he can say or think whatever he wants to say or think. When he raises his hand or asks another to do so against a fellow human being is where the line is crossed.
  - sangnoir 9y ago
    > At one point someone tried to rush the stage, though we don't know his motivations. That person was beaten, which should have resulted in the arrests of everyone involved. The person who rushed the stage was Isadore Greenbaum. All he did was shout "Down with Hitler!" and knock down a microphone[1]. He was the only one arrested and was further charged with disorderly conduct[1]. None of his assailants were charged or arrested. 1. http://www.historynet.com/made-in-america-americans-in-support-of-the-nazi-cause.htm http://www.historynet.com/made-in-america-americans-in-suppo...
    - KekDemaga 9y ago
      Could a reasonable person think that he intended to harm someone on the stage? If so that was the correct legal outcome no matter how unfortunate.
      - sangnoir 9y ago
        I made no judgement - I merely stated the facts.
  - flachsechs 9y ago
    read my post again carefully. my point is actually that _no_ non-white american people would be shocked. i'm not really talking about white people at all, because obviously there are some who would be and wouldn't be shocked at widespread racism by white people. this is a subtle point that you are missing, which is ironic because you are 25% asian, i imagine you have seen quite a bit of anti-asian racism (it's just a joke bro! don't you love being the butt of jokes? who doesn't love that!) from white people because they have no idea you have asian family. and i'll just pre-empt your next point: i'm not saying only white poeple can be racist, that's obviously not the case if you've ever been overseas, and anti-white racism also happens a lot in america. i'll generalize my point for you, so that you may understand: no person of a minority race would be shocked that the majority race harbors a not-insignificant subpopulation with vehement racist views against other races. if every single majority race were to spend a week as a minority, that would likely dispel any notions they had of the contrary. ^ this works for all races.
mtgx 9y ago
I'm confused by that logic. If they were communists, then how would they represent such a threat economically to Germans? Were rich jews re-distributing a large portion of their wealth to other jews, too, so they are better off? I just don't understand how he made the connection "those guys do so much better than us economically -> they must be communists!"
- eli_gottlieb 9y ago
  Good job being confused by nonsense! Antisemitism (and similar styles of racism) has always been based on a level of double-think: that the enemy race (in this case, the Jews) are both strong enough to be mortally threatening, and weak enough to fall to the first solid blow.
ZeroGravitas 9y ago
See also the industrialists who as well as aiding the Nazi's tried to overthrow the US Government in the 1930s: >In 1936, William Dodd, the U.S. Ambassador to Germany, wrote a letter to President Roosevelt in which he stated, > > A clique of U.S. industrialists is hell-bent to bring a fascist state to supplant our democratic government and is working closely with the fascist regime in Germany and Italy. I have had plenty of opportunity in my post in Berlin to witness how close some of our American ruling families are to the Nazi regime. ... A prominent executive of one of the largest corporations, told me point blank that he would be ready to take definite action to bring fascism into America if President Roosevelt continued his progressive policies. Certain American industrialists had a great deal to do with bringing fascist regimes into being in both Germany and Italy. They extended aid to help Fascism occupy the seat of power, and they are helping to keep it there. Propagandists for fascist groups try to dismiss the fascist scare. We should be aware of the symptoms. When industrialists ignore laws designed for social and economic progress they will seek recourse to a fascist state when the institutions of our government compel them to comply with the provisions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_Plot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_Plot
- godelmachine 9y ago
  Was Henry Ford a part of this plot, considering he was a big fan of Hitler?
  - rurban 9y ago
    No, he was kind of an outsider nazi amongst the high profile banking, industry and press nazis those times. He was a newcomer and threatened the establishment with his success and unusual methods. This clique of U.S. industrialists (the old fascists) were the leaders in banking, oil, coal, chemical, steel, press: JP Morgan, Hunt, Rockefeller, Carnegie, Vanderbilt, Du Pont, Hearst.
    - godelmachine 9y ago
      Read on Wikipedia 2 min ago that Rockefeller Foundation funded Nazi eugenics.
Amezarak 9y ago
Not only that, but many policies we now regard as being Nazi were widespread and popular in the West in general. Eugenics, for example, was promoted by all sorts of celebrities, politicians, and everyday people and many Western countries engaged in highly unethical eugenics programs. To think we fought Nazis because of their ideology is a mistake - the US, the UK, and many other countries weren't that different, in many respects, ideologically. In practice, the Nazis took horrific ideas and industrialized them. In a way, we have Nazi military imperialism to thank for the fact that many horrible ideas are unacceptable today - otherwise there might never have been a backlash against them.
- maxerickson 9y ago
  The US had active eugenics programs into the 1970s. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics_in_the_United_States
- daxorid 9y ago
  ...yes, which is very unfortunate. Without the moral baggage of WW2 and the unfortunate implementation history of eugenics programs in the 20th century, it may be easier for people to accept that encouraging the gradual improvement of the gene pool would actually be a positive thing for human civilization. The one and only semi-acceptable eugenics practice in the modern West is the termination of pregnancies of Trisomy-21 fetuses. Any hint of extending that acceptance any further, and you're instantly a Nazi.
  - mooseburger 9y ago
    So much suffering is caused by genes, from physical to mental illnesses. It's hard to imagine what would be wrong with a world where no one got cancer, became schizophrenic, or perhaps, even suffered from depression. The big danger I guess is that we end up deciding there is only one (or perhaps a couple) valid human "types", and eccentric perspectives that create value (in any sense) are lost, not through extermination, but because they just are never created to begin with. The gradual improvement of the gene pool will likely happen anyway, as parents choose to use new technologies to improve their future children in various ways.
danans 9y ago
> I thought it was common knowledge that support for Nazis in America was widespread all the way leading to American involvement in WW2. It's certainly not common knowledge, and most school history books don't include it (at least when I was in school). They do cover the Jim Crow laws and the KKK but don't make a connection between those and Nazi ideology. Even less common is knowledge of how much the Nazis themselves were inspired by American style racist laws and organizations: http://www.history.com/news/how-the-nazis-were-inspired-by-jim-crow http://www.history.com/news/how-the-nazis-were-inspired-by-j... EDIT: wording
- godelmachine 9y ago
  Hitler was highly inspired by Manifest Destiny
pmoriarty 9y ago
Not only was there widespread support of the Nazis in America, but the Nazis' views on race were inspired by the "science" of Eugenics, which was also widespread in America, and by the American KKK. After the war, prominent Nazis were hired by the US government.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
Feniks 9y ago
Common knowledge? No that chapter was glossed over. One funny is story is how the US put a trade embargo on Japan (leading to them launching Pearl Harbour attack) while at the same time allowing US companies trade oil and other resources with the Reich. The Nazi blitzkrieg ran on US oil... Greatest generation indeed.

flachsechs 9y ago

if every white american spent a week as another race, i don't think a single one would be 'shocked' or 'flabbergasted' about any of this.

js2 9y ago
http://galactanet.com/oneoff/theegg_mod.html http://galactanet.com/oneoff/theegg_mod.html
kevmo 9y ago
I wish "Black Like Me" were mandatory reading in public schools: Black Like Me, first published in 1961, is a nonfiction book by white journalist John Howard Griffin recounting his journey in the Deep South of the United States, at a time when African-Americans lived under Racial Segregation. Griffin was a native of Dallas, Texas, who had his skin temporarily darkened to pass as a black man. He traveled for six weeks throughout the racially segregated states of Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Arkansas, and Georgia to explore life from the other side of the color line. It's short and fascinating. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Like_Me https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Like_Me
- ibn_ibid 9y ago
  or...you could read something written by an actual black person?
merpnderp 9y ago
Did you just "white privilege" and undercover citizen trying to expose Nazi's ~80 years ago because he was shocked at how widespread support was? Your point is that if he'd been black he wouldn't have been shocked by Nazi support?
- flachsechs 9y ago
  i didn't make any of those points, but you just did, and then ascribed them to me, which is pretty typical of online discussions. it's called a straw-man argument. the reason it's so widespread is it's so easy to do. all you have to do is come up with a bunch of stuff you dislike, and then accuse me of being/doing that stuff. and there's nothing i can really do about it, because these ideas exist only in your head, not mine.
- ZeroGravitas 9y ago
  Well, I find it unlikely that a Chinese, Mexican or African-American would have been surprised that a high ranking law enforcement officer was openly supportive of the people terrorising their communities in those days. To be honest I'm a little surprised that a Jewish person would be that naive either, particularly a lawyer that helped found the ADL.
- okreallywtf 9y ago
  Do you disagree that being white, on average, causes one to be less exposed to racism? I don't think that is a particularly radical concept. I also think that being a male, on average, causes one to be less directly exposed to cat-calling and other everyday-sexism. Do you take offense at my suggestion of male privilege?
  - merpnderp 9y ago
    On average? You going to measure that in a lab and show me your margin of error, or is this now a political discussion? And "male privilege" is dumb. Measure it - show me your science. Otherwise I'll think about how many men die on the job versus women, how women receive more lenient sentences for the same crime, or how women now receive the majority of degrees, and a women who never has kids or marries, will make significantly more money over her life than a similar man, and I think "Weird, it's like biology strangely enough, affects our culture in all sorts of crazy ways that having nothing to do with some nut job conspiracy theory about male patriarchy."
cabaalis 9y ago
You're on this site, so I hope you recognize the stereotyping and assumptions of character in your statement. I am white, ~25% Filipino also, but light skinned so historically I have been taken as a white male. I'm not shocked or flabbergasted at all by this because I am an American and part of our laws that we hold very dear allows us to publicly espouse views that are repugnant. I heard the speaker saying terrible things about Jews, which no thinking person would ever support. I did not hear him inciting or suggesting attacks against them though, which would be illegal. At one point someone tried to rush the stage, though we don't know his motivations. That person was beaten, which should have resulted in the arrests of everyone involved. Other than that, he can say or think whatever he wants to say or think. When he raises his hand or asks another to do so against a fellow human being is where the line is crossed.
- sangnoir 9y ago
  > At one point someone tried to rush the stage, though we don't know his motivations. That person was beaten, which should have resulted in the arrests of everyone involved. The person who rushed the stage was Isadore Greenbaum. All he did was shout "Down with Hitler!" and knock down a microphone[1]. He was the only one arrested and was further charged with disorderly conduct[1]. None of his assailants were charged or arrested. 1. http://www.historynet.com/made-in-america-americans-in-support-of-the-nazi-cause.htm http://www.historynet.com/made-in-america-americans-in-suppo...
  - KekDemaga 9y ago
    Could a reasonable person think that he intended to harm someone on the stage? If so that was the correct legal outcome no matter how unfortunate.
    - sangnoir 9y ago
      I made no judgement - I merely stated the facts.
- flachsechs 9y ago
  read my post again carefully. my point is actually that _no_ non-white american people would be shocked. i'm not really talking about white people at all, because obviously there are some who would be and wouldn't be shocked at widespread racism by white people. this is a subtle point that you are missing, which is ironic because you are 25% asian, i imagine you have seen quite a bit of anti-asian racism (it's just a joke bro! don't you love being the butt of jokes? who doesn't love that!) from white people because they have no idea you have asian family. and i'll just pre-empt your next point: i'm not saying only white poeple can be racist, that's obviously not the case if you've ever been overseas, and anti-white racism also happens a lot in america. i'll generalize my point for you, so that you may understand: no person of a minority race would be shocked that the majority race harbors a not-insignificant subpopulation with vehement racist views against other races. if every single majority race were to spend a week as a minority, that would likely dispel any notions they had of the contrary. ^ this works for all races.

mtgx 9y ago

I'm confused by that logic. If they were communists, then how would they represent such a threat economically to Germans? Were rich jews re-distributing a large portion of their wealth to other jews, too, so they are better off? I just don't understand how he made the connection "those guys do so much better than us economically -> they must be communists!"

eli_gottlieb 9y ago
Good job being confused by nonsense! Antisemitism (and similar styles of racism) has always been based on a level of double-think: that the enemy race (in this case, the Jews) are both strong enough to be mortally threatening, and weak enough to fall to the first solid blow.

ZeroGravitas 9y ago

See also the industrialists who as well as aiding the Nazi's tried to overthrow the US Government in the 1930s: >In 1936, William Dodd, the U.S. Ambassador to Germany, wrote a letter to President Roosevelt in which he stated, > > A clique of U.S. industrialists is hell-bent to bring a fascist state to supplant our democratic government and is working closely with the fascist regime in Germany and Italy. I have had plenty of opportunity in my post in Berlin to witness how close some of our American ruling families are to the Nazi regime. ... A prominent executive of one of the largest corporations, told me point blank that he would be ready to take definite action to bring fascism into America if President Roosevelt continued his progressive policies. Certain American industrialists had a great deal to do with bringing fascist regimes into being in both Germany and Italy. They extended aid to help Fascism occupy the seat of power, and they are helping to keep it there. Propagandists for fascist groups try to dismiss the fascist scare. We should be aware of the symptoms. When industrialists ignore laws designed for social and economic progress they will seek recourse to a fascist state when the institutions of our government compel them to comply with the provisions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_Plot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_Plot

godelmachine 9y ago
Was Henry Ford a part of this plot, considering he was a big fan of Hitler?
- rurban 9y ago
  No, he was kind of an outsider nazi amongst the high profile banking, industry and press nazis those times. He was a newcomer and threatened the establishment with his success and unusual methods. This clique of U.S. industrialists (the old fascists) were the leaders in banking, oil, coal, chemical, steel, press: JP Morgan, Hunt, Rockefeller, Carnegie, Vanderbilt, Du Pont, Hearst.
  - godelmachine 9y ago
    Read on Wikipedia 2 min ago that Rockefeller Foundation funded Nazi eugenics.

Amezarak 9y ago

Not only that, but many policies we now regard as being Nazi were widespread and popular in the West in general. Eugenics, for example, was promoted by all sorts of celebrities, politicians, and everyday people and many Western countries engaged in highly unethical eugenics programs. To think we fought Nazis because of their ideology is a mistake - the US, the UK, and many other countries weren't that different, in many respects, ideologically. In practice, the Nazis took horrific ideas and industrialized them. In a way, we have Nazi military imperialism to thank for the fact that many horrible ideas are unacceptable today - otherwise there might never have been a backlash against them.

maxerickson 9y ago
The US had active eugenics programs into the 1970s. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics_in_the_United_States
daxorid 9y ago
...yes, which is very unfortunate. Without the moral baggage of WW2 and the unfortunate implementation history of eugenics programs in the 20th century, it may be easier for people to accept that encouraging the gradual improvement of the gene pool would actually be a positive thing for human civilization. The one and only semi-acceptable eugenics practice in the modern West is the termination of pregnancies of Trisomy-21 fetuses. Any hint of extending that acceptance any further, and you're instantly a Nazi.
- mooseburger 9y ago
  So much suffering is caused by genes, from physical to mental illnesses. It's hard to imagine what would be wrong with a world where no one got cancer, became schizophrenic, or perhaps, even suffered from depression. The big danger I guess is that we end up deciding there is only one (or perhaps a couple) valid human "types", and eccentric perspectives that create value (in any sense) are lost, not through extermination, but because they just are never created to begin with. The gradual improvement of the gene pool will likely happen anyway, as parents choose to use new technologies to improve their future children in various ways.

danans 9y ago

> I thought it was common knowledge that support for Nazis in America was widespread all the way leading to American involvement in WW2. It's certainly not common knowledge, and most school history books don't include it (at least when I was in school). They do cover the Jim Crow laws and the KKK but don't make a connection between those and Nazi ideology. Even less common is knowledge of how much the Nazis themselves were inspired by American style racist laws and organizations: http://www.history.com/news/how-the-nazis-were-inspired-by-jim-crow http://www.history.com/news/how-the-nazis-were-inspired-by-j... EDIT: wording

godelmachine 9y ago
Hitler was highly inspired by Manifest Destiny

pmoriarty 9y ago

Not only was there widespread support of the Nazis in America, but the Nazis' views on race were inspired by the "science" of Eugenics, which was also widespread in America, and by the American KKK. After the war, prominent Nazis were hired by the US government.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

Feniks 9y ago

Common knowledge? No that chapter was glossed over. One funny is story is how the US put a trade embargo on Japan (leading to them launching Pearl Harbour attack) while at the same time allowing US companies trade oil and other resources with the Reich. The Nazi blitzkrieg ran on US oil... Greatest generation indeed.