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Even if I don't agree with it (or with its opposite) I think it is a legitimate opinion expressed in a respectful manner.

by Udik 9y ago

pcwalton 9y ago
No, it's not. The comment is stating that I, along with all the other Irish-Americans, should not be in the United States. That's prima facie disrespectful. It's even more disrespectful to African-Americans, of course. The fact that the comment only logically implies that instead of stating it explicitly doesn't make it any better, it just makes it obscurantist.
- gragas 9y ago
  I'm an Irish-American myself! That's not what I'm saying at all! I'm pointing out that racism has existed towards Irish-Americans and that racism still does exist towards African-Americans (and essentially every ethnic group in the US). For context, here is my original comment, since it is now censored by those who disagree: "It will be very hard to tear down the walls of peaceful homogeneity, since Japan takes so many steps to preserve its culture. Of the very few people who successfully naturalize as Japanese citizens, all of them have to legally take on a Japanese name. Japanese citizens are proud of their demographic and seek to maintain it. This has worked very well for Japan. In all heterogeneous countries, you see strife for decades at a minimum---see the Irish immigrants in America in the 19th and 20th centuries---and centuries or eternity at a maximum---see African Americans. There is a threshold of difference between ethnic groups where, if you cross this threshold, turmoil and hatred and discrimination will fester, no matter what. This can be seen in America, with its numerous, very distinct ethnic groups, and in Europe, with its massive influx of Middle Eastern and African immigrants. Regardless of how many want to get along, a large portion of both sides will inevitably hate each other, and will vote accordingly. I'm not sure what the solution is to heterogeneous societies. I think it can be worked out. But it is insanity to claim multiculturalism works in its current state and homogeneity does not. All of the most peaceful, successful societies the world has seen so far have been largely homogeneous. Japan is a fantastic modern example."
southphillyman 9y ago
Nah, I literally just heard someone make this same argument yesterday on another site while trying to argue that "white genocide" was occuring in America. They even referenced Japan, smh. Heterogeneity is the cost of colonization. If you spend hundreds of years using people as cheap labor or stealing resources from their communities you are going to have an influx of those same people integrating into a culture they are now familiar with.
dang 9y ago
pcwalton is right—this is boilerplate ideological battle. That's a violation of both HN's rules and its spirit. This is not a site for race war, however "respectful" its "manner". More here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15451825 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15451825, and in countless other comments sctb and I have posted.

Even if I don't agree with it (or with its opposite) I think it is a legitimate opinion expressed in a respectful manner.

by Udik 9y ago

Even if I don't agree with it (or with its opposite) I think it is a legitimate opinion expressed in a respectful manner.

pcwalton 9y ago

No, it's not. The comment is stating that I, along with all the other Irish-Americans, should not be in the United States. That's prima facie disrespectful. It's even more disrespectful to African-Americans, of course. The fact that the comment only logically implies that instead of stating it explicitly doesn't make it any better, it just makes it obscurantist.

gragas 9y ago
I'm an Irish-American myself! That's not what I'm saying at all! I'm pointing out that racism has existed towards Irish-Americans and that racism still does exist towards African-Americans (and essentially every ethnic group in the US). For context, here is my original comment, since it is now censored by those who disagree: "It will be very hard to tear down the walls of peaceful homogeneity, since Japan takes so many steps to preserve its culture. Of the very few people who successfully naturalize as Japanese citizens, all of them have to legally take on a Japanese name. Japanese citizens are proud of their demographic and seek to maintain it. This has worked very well for Japan. In all heterogeneous countries, you see strife for decades at a minimum---see the Irish immigrants in America in the 19th and 20th centuries---and centuries or eternity at a maximum---see African Americans. There is a threshold of difference between ethnic groups where, if you cross this threshold, turmoil and hatred and discrimination will fester, no matter what. This can be seen in America, with its numerous, very distinct ethnic groups, and in Europe, with its massive influx of Middle Eastern and African immigrants. Regardless of how many want to get along, a large portion of both sides will inevitably hate each other, and will vote accordingly. I'm not sure what the solution is to heterogeneous societies. I think it can be worked out. But it is insanity to claim multiculturalism works in its current state and homogeneity does not. All of the most peaceful, successful societies the world has seen so far have been largely homogeneous. Japan is a fantastic modern example."

southphillyman 9y ago

Nah, I literally just heard someone make this same argument yesterday on another site while trying to argue that "white genocide" was occuring in America. They even referenced Japan, smh. Heterogeneity is the cost of colonization. If you spend hundreds of years using people as cheap labor or stealing resources from their communities you are going to have an influx of those same people integrating into a culture they are now familiar with.

dang 9y ago

pcwalton is right—this is boilerplate ideological battle. That's a violation of both HN's rules and its spirit. This is not a site for race war, however "respectful" its "manner". More here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15451825 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15451825, and in countless other comments sctb and I have posted.