3 ms·

If they don't want to join, then what is the problem? Their life, their choice. Do we see as many article about the lack of women in waste management? I think

by arkh 9y ago

If they don't want to join, then what is the problem? Their life, their choice. Do we see as many article about the lack of women in waste management? I think that's because seem like easy well-payed jobs. The reality is stupid hours, stupid management and no life. Only people who value money more than their time would choose to stay there. But hey! A possible solution would be to force women to learn to code then work there for decades. We could start with those who chose to become journalist or some other humanities major. Women are too stupid to choose the right path for them, am I right? /s

stale2002 9y ago
No, a better solution would be to fix the rampant problems of sexism in tech so that women aren't driven out of it. Problem should be fixed. They should be fixed because they are problems that make lots of people unhappy and keep them out of high paying jobs. Women aren't stupid for choosing to not subject themselves to rampant sexism. That's actually smart. But fixing a huge problem that effects lots and lots of people is objectively a good thing. Your argument is equivalent to saying "hey, black people don't want to report things to the police, because they are afraid of the police (do to them being shot at a much higher rate), but that's THEIR problem because it is their life and their choice to not have access to the police system whenever a crime accures to them and they choice to not report it". That argument would be a bad argument, because even though they are "choosing" to not report things to the police (and therefore have to way to not get justice for crimes committed against them), we should still work to fix the problem of them being RATIONALLY afraid of the police (perhaps by trying to convince police to shoot them less). Look, if you really don't care about a major problem that is effecting lots of people, we could at least look at this from a purely selfish perspective for the company. When women leave an industry the company loses lots of money, because they have lost a high skilled worker. Therefore it is an objectively good thing for the tech industry to solve this major problem that is causing the industry to lose so many highly skilled workers. Because that cost money. The reason there are more articles about this than simply bad management is because a hostile work environment for lots of people is a much worse problem that effects people in worse ways. How do I "know" that it is a worse problem? Well that's because women are being driven out in droves. Obviously it is a worse problem, as evidenced by the sheer number of people for whom it causes to leave their very high paying jobs.
- arkh 9y ago
  Here is my problem and I think a lot of people's problem. The only sexism I've seen in tech is benevolent sexism. People interrupting you in meetings? Same thing for men. People who shit on your work? Same thing for most men. Bad jokes? I mean, put an audio recorder in a room full of men and see how it can be. Most techies I know have been raised to be respectful of women. I'd say even too much. So when suddenly tech becomes fashionable because there's lot of money there and most outsider media start bashing the field for being full of misogynists I'm starting to get a feeling of cognitive dissonance. A feeling of 1984 becoming reality. How do men react then? They start getting distant and avoid interacting with women. And now you get articles about the lack of mentoring of women and how men don't interact the same way with women than they do with other men. It's like the only way would be for men to live, think and interact exactly like women. And soon we'll have the same thing in the workplace as in school: men are defective women. Maybe women should start their own tech companies and recruit other women if men lead ones are not good enough for them.

by arkh 9y ago

stale2002 9y ago

No, a better solution would be to fix the rampant problems of sexism in tech so that women aren't driven out of it. Problem should be fixed. They should be fixed because they are problems that make lots of people unhappy and keep them out of high paying jobs. Women aren't stupid for choosing to not subject themselves to rampant sexism. That's actually smart. But fixing a huge problem that effects lots and lots of people is objectively a good thing. Your argument is equivalent to saying "hey, black people don't want to report things to the police, because they are afraid of the police (do to them being shot at a much higher rate), but that's THEIR problem because it is their life and their choice to not have access to the police system whenever a crime accures to them and they choice to not report it". That argument would be a bad argument, because even though they are "choosing" to not report things to the police (and therefore have to way to not get justice for crimes committed against them), we should still work to fix the problem of them being RATIONALLY afraid of the police (perhaps by trying to convince police to shoot them less). Look, if you really don't care about a major problem that is effecting lots of people, we could at least look at this from a purely selfish perspective for the company. When women leave an industry the company loses lots of money, because they have lost a high skilled worker. Therefore it is an objectively good thing for the tech industry to solve this major problem that is causing the industry to lose so many highly skilled workers. Because that cost money. The reason there are more articles about this than simply bad management is because a hostile work environment for lots of people is a much worse problem that effects people in worse ways. How do I "know" that it is a worse problem? Well that's because women are being driven out in droves. Obviously it is a worse problem, as evidenced by the sheer number of people for whom it causes to leave their very high paying jobs.

arkh 9y ago
Here is my problem and I think a lot of people's problem. The only sexism I've seen in tech is benevolent sexism. People interrupting you in meetings? Same thing for men. People who shit on your work? Same thing for most men. Bad jokes? I mean, put an audio recorder in a room full of men and see how it can be. Most techies I know have been raised to be respectful of women. I'd say even too much. So when suddenly tech becomes fashionable because there's lot of money there and most outsider media start bashing the field for being full of misogynists I'm starting to get a feeling of cognitive dissonance. A feeling of 1984 becoming reality. How do men react then? They start getting distant and avoid interacting with women. And now you get articles about the lack of mentoring of women and how men don't interact the same way with women than they do with other men. It's like the only way would be for men to live, think and interact exactly like women. And soon we'll have the same thing in the workplace as in school: men are defective women. Maybe women should start their own tech companies and recruit other women if men lead ones are not good enough for them.