7 ms·

Interesting system where you can bring your own things to prison instead of being forced to buy 300% price increased items from the prison commissary in N. Amer

Interesting system where you can bring your own things to prison instead of being forced to buy 300% price increased items from the prison commissary in N. America like clothing, fans, radios. System here is very different in other ways such as being in a 200+ inmate dorm is the standard instead of cells, and there's dozens of rules set by inmates none of which were in this guide. You also get a 'prison consultant' if you can in the US if you are pleading guilty, they help you choose your own prison as part of the plea deal such as Madoff who's prison lets him teach other inmates economics.

deleted 9y ago
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alex_hitchins 9y ago
You can bring some items, but you couldn't bring a telly etc. There was talk a while back about banning books being sent to prisioners, not sure what logic was used for that one. I haven't been to prison in the UK or the US however what I've seen of both, the US system seems straight up about making money over anything else. I'd hope the UK system isn't this way although I fear it likely is going that way.
- alkonaut 9y ago
  This manual indicates the UK prison system is much more like the US system than I expected. e.g. shared prison cells.
  - t90fan 9y ago
    thats more an artefact of the fact that most of our prisons were built in the 1800s. 2 in a cell is common. Until the 90s they never had indoor plumbing either, only buckets in the cells. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slopping_out https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slopping_out
    - alex_hitchins 9y ago
      The following article is worth a read too on the subject: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_Strangeways_Prison_riot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_Strangeways_Prison_riot I believe it was the squalid conditions that sparked the unrest.
      - KGIII 9y ago
        There are a number of documentaries where the instigators cite conditions and staff abuses as the reason for the Strangeways Riot. The two most serious ringleaders are both now free, or were in the most recent doc, and are doing fairl well. One is fond of handing out papers with motivational or philosophical thoughts on them and the other now has his own gym.
- cjrp 9y ago
  > I'd hope the UK system isn't this way although I fear it likely is going that way I fear the same, for example: "On 16 December 2016, some 600 prisoners took part in a riot at HM Prison Birmingham, a prison in Birmingham, England, operated by G4S.[71] The disturbance was described as the worst in Britain since the 1990 Strangeways riot." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G4S#Activities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G4S#Activities
jdietrich 9y ago
The British prison system became increasingly chaotic during the 1980s, culminating in the notorious 25-day riot in Strangeways prison in 1990. The response was a five-month public enquiry led by Lord Woolf that prompted major reform throughout the prison system. Perhaps the most important single change was the introduction of the Incentives and Earned Privileges scheme. Woolf recognised something that seems obvious in hindsight - prisoners on a bread-and-water regime have little incentive to comply with prison rules, because they have nothing to gain and very little to lose. Offering small luxuries like the right to wear your own clothing, access to a games console or a small amount of discretionary spending gives prisoners the opportunity to make rational choices about their own circumstances. In 2013, the Conservative government made the catastrophic decision to "toughen up" the regime and withdraw parts of the IEP scheme, while also cutting prison expenditure and staffing ratios. The results were entirely predictable - a huge increase in prison violence and disorder. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_Strangeways_Prison_riot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_Strangeways_Prison_riot http://www.doingtime.co.uk/how-prisons-work/how-do-prisons-actually-work/incentive-and-earned-privileges-ieps/ http://www.doingtime.co.uk/how-prisons-work/how-do-prisons-a...
- MistahKoala 9y ago
  I'd lay the blame more specifically at Chris Grayling's feet, rather than the Government as a whole. How far he got I don't know, but Michael Gove was addressing IEPs when he took over as Justice Secretary. I felt it was a real shame to have lost him from that role.
  - jdietrich 9y ago
    The fundamental blunder was appointing Grayling in the first place. He had an ignorant, regressive attitude to criminal justice that we haven't seen since Michael Howard. In addition to wrecking the prison service, Grayling did grievous damage to the courts with the Criminal Courts Charge and the massive cuts to Legal Aid. Gove spent most of his tenure as Justice Secretary undoing the damage that Grayling had done. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jan/28/michael-gove-in-u-turn-over-legal-aid-fund https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jan/28/michael-gov...

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

alex_hitchins 9y ago

You can bring some items, but you couldn't bring a telly etc. There was talk a while back about banning books being sent to prisioners, not sure what logic was used for that one. I haven't been to prison in the UK or the US however what I've seen of both, the US system seems straight up about making money over anything else. I'd hope the UK system isn't this way although I fear it likely is going that way.

alkonaut 9y ago
This manual indicates the UK prison system is much more like the US system than I expected. e.g. shared prison cells.
- t90fan 9y ago
  thats more an artefact of the fact that most of our prisons were built in the 1800s. 2 in a cell is common. Until the 90s they never had indoor plumbing either, only buckets in the cells. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slopping_out https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slopping_out
  - alex_hitchins 9y ago
    The following article is worth a read too on the subject: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_Strangeways_Prison_riot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_Strangeways_Prison_riot I believe it was the squalid conditions that sparked the unrest.
    - KGIII 9y ago
      There are a number of documentaries where the instigators cite conditions and staff abuses as the reason for the Strangeways Riot. The two most serious ringleaders are both now free, or were in the most recent doc, and are doing fairl well. One is fond of handing out papers with motivational or philosophical thoughts on them and the other now has his own gym.
cjrp 9y ago
> I'd hope the UK system isn't this way although I fear it likely is going that way I fear the same, for example: "On 16 December 2016, some 600 prisoners took part in a riot at HM Prison Birmingham, a prison in Birmingham, England, operated by G4S.[71] The disturbance was described as the worst in Britain since the 1990 Strangeways riot." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G4S#Activities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G4S#Activities

jdietrich 9y ago

The British prison system became increasingly chaotic during the 1980s, culminating in the notorious 25-day riot in Strangeways prison in 1990. The response was a five-month public enquiry led by Lord Woolf that prompted major reform throughout the prison system. Perhaps the most important single change was the introduction of the Incentives and Earned Privileges scheme. Woolf recognised something that seems obvious in hindsight - prisoners on a bread-and-water regime have little incentive to comply with prison rules, because they have nothing to gain and very little to lose. Offering small luxuries like the right to wear your own clothing, access to a games console or a small amount of discretionary spending gives prisoners the opportunity to make rational choices about their own circumstances. In 2013, the Conservative government made the catastrophic decision to "toughen up" the regime and withdraw parts of the IEP scheme, while also cutting prison expenditure and staffing ratios. The results were entirely predictable - a huge increase in prison violence and disorder. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_Strangeways_Prison_riot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_Strangeways_Prison_riot http://www.doingtime.co.uk/how-prisons-work/how-do-prisons-actually-work/incentive-and-earned-privileges-ieps/ http://www.doingtime.co.uk/how-prisons-work/how-do-prisons-a...

MistahKoala 9y ago
I'd lay the blame more specifically at Chris Grayling's feet, rather than the Government as a whole. How far he got I don't know, but Michael Gove was addressing IEPs when he took over as Justice Secretary. I felt it was a real shame to have lost him from that role.
- jdietrich 9y ago
  The fundamental blunder was appointing Grayling in the first place. He had an ignorant, regressive attitude to criminal justice that we haven't seen since Michael Howard. In addition to wrecking the prison service, Grayling did grievous damage to the courts with the Criminal Courts Charge and the massive cuts to Legal Aid. Gove spent most of his tenure as Justice Secretary undoing the damage that Grayling had done. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jan/28/michael-gove-in-u-turn-over-legal-aid-fund https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jan/28/michael-gov...