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OT: I am in the market for an upgrade to my home PC. I use it for Compiling and Gaming. I am finding the sheer variety of CPU's and their weird naming convent

OT: I am in the market for an upgrade to my home PC. I use it for Compiling and Gaming. I am finding the sheer variety of CPU's and their weird naming conventions utterly confusing. Then combine that with the almost-as-confusing choice of motherboards and the bit-better-but-not-much choice of RAM and I am completely lost. Any tips out there for finding a path through this maze, how do I upgrade my PC without requiring an advanced degree in Intel/AMD marketing speak? EDIT: Added use of PC.

Kayou 9y ago
Basically, IPC in an Intel core is a bit better than in an AMD core. Keeping this in mind, you can compare core counts, frequency, power draw, PCIe lines or whatever floats your boat. To compensate for a lower IPC, AMD will give you more cores (sometimes a lot) for the same price. It all depends of what you need your processing power for.
theandrewbailey 9y ago
What are you doing? Gaming? Rendering? Video editing? Compiling?
- ccalvert 9y ago
  Not sure about SeanDav, but I do a lot of compiling and wonder if anyone has any suggestions about the best CPU to buy. I want short wait times for a compile, but I still care about price. I don't want to go over $500 but would prefer less.
  - dman 9y ago
    Look at the Ryzen 1700X. Its a full fledged 8 core and down to 299 (https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B06X3W9NGG/55467-20/ref=gb1h_img_m-3_3342_169dd9fc?smid=AANSFONOCR8T3&psc=1&pf_rd_m=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_s=merchandised-search-3 https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B06X3W9NGG/55467-20/...). Dont think Intel has something that comes close to that for compile times at that price point (If someone has a counter point on this I would love to be corrected).
    - shadowfacts 9y ago
      If you're willing to overclock, the 1700 would be a bit better as the price is a bit lower and it can hit the same clock speeds (after OCing).
      - loeg 9y ago
        It's worth noting that not all 1700s can hit the 1700X or 1800X speeds. There is a degree of luck in overclocking. Also, it's only a useful suggestion if you don't mind losing your warranty.
  - phaedrus 9y ago
    My experience with GCC and compiling C++ has been that performance scales nearly linearly with core count. In other words, compiling C++ gets great benefits from parallelism - provided you configure your build to take advantage of it. (For make use the -j N option where N=num cores + 1; for Code::Blocks it is a preferences option. Not sure about Visual Studio.) Things that do not parallelize: the final linking step (especially with mingw), compilation if all your code is one giant CPP file (prefer small files). Assuming you have an SSD, your project is configured for parallel build, and your code is organized into many small CPP files, more cores == more better. I look for the highest core count CPUs with the lowest power. Last year I built a dual CPU Xeon workstation / home server using 1.8 GHz 14-core chips (mostly from second-hand used hardware to save money). I feel that that low clock speed is actually an advantage, because even with 2 sockets and 8 sticks of 8 Gb RAM, it idles at only 75W (at the outlet, as measured with a Kill-a-Watt). With 56 total threads, it builds my C++ project in 2.0 seconds flat, something which takes almost 2 minutes single-threaded. (I think the fact that there are 60 seconds in a minute, that 56 ~= 60, and that the build time went from 2 minutes to 2 seconds is not coincidental.) Unfortunately a hardware problem with one of the used components seems to be causing the machine to lock up under Linux, and I never had the time to troubleshoot it, and moved on to a different codebase which doesn't require as much compilation so haven't yet had motivation to track down the problem.
    - BeetleB 9y ago
      Keep in mind that with more parallelism, the memory consumption goes up as well. That should be included in cost considerations.
Symmetry 9y ago
Looking at the ~$375-$400 price point, the new 6 core Intel 8700k will compile large C projects ever so slightly faster[1] and might be faster or slower for games depending on which one and othe details. [2][3] I'd tend to go with AMD right now just because they don't play tricks with fusing off certain functions for market segmentation reasons. Basically, look at independent benchmarks close to what you're doing. For choosing everything else many websites put together system guides laying out a set of compatible components they think are good at the same part of the market. Those tend to be very gaming focused but I think that's a good starting point. Intel just released a new top end chip so they're all out of date but the recommendations here[4] are where I'd advise you to look if you want a new system now. The prices have come down a bit since the guide was written, though. Or there's the Build a PC subreddit wiki as an information resource. [5] [1]https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=intel-coffee-8700k&num=6 https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=intel-co... [2]https://www.anandtech.com/show/11859/the-anandtech-coffee-lake-review-8700k-and-8400-initial-numbers/13 https://www.anandtech.com/show/11859/the-anandtech-coffee-la... [3]http://techreport.com/review/32642/intel-core-i7-8700k-cpu-reviewed/6 http://techreport.com/review/32642/intel-core-i7-8700k-cpu-r... [4]http://techreport.com/review/32474/the-tech-report-system-guide-september-2017-edition http://techreport.com/review/32474/the-tech-report-system-gu... [5]https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/wiki/index https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/wiki/index
fencepost 9y ago
IIRC it started as a "compiled wisdom of 4chan gaming boards" and has morphed into affiliate links, but you might still find the Logical Increments list useful (http://www.logicalincrements.com/ http://www.logicalincrements.com/)
nfriedly 9y ago
http://www.logicalincrements.com/ http://www.logicalincrements.com/ is a handy site that recommends PC builds that give you a good bang-for-buck at various price points. On a given horizontal line, the CPU, motherboard, and RAM will all be compatible. The site is tilted for gaming, but GPUs are mostly interchangeable - so if you want more compute power, you can drop to a lower GPU and spend the money on the CPU instead.
- ksk 9y ago
  That is a great website ! It would be nice if they also offered/crowdsourced benchmarks.
- nfriedly 9y ago
  Oh, and the #1 upgrade you can make for everyday use is a SSD. I was recently impressed at just how fast an old Core 2 Duo system was once I installed an SSD. It won't do much for gaming (aside from improving load times), but it will make the rest of the things you do on the computer more pleasant.
ksk 9y ago
I think the best option for you is to just buy a new machine from Dell or something. They've done all that work for you !
seanalltogether 9y ago
I built an always on but mostly idle side computer (gaming, storage, media server) from this guide and I couldn't be happier. https://techbuyersguru.com/1250-quiet-gaming-pc-build https://techbuyersguru.com/1250-quiet-gaming-pc-build The best part is I never hear it, even when gaming the fans seem to barely kick in.
LeifCarrotson 9y ago
Honestly, Anandtech's linked "Best X" articles are one of the best resources for this on the web. Compare their "Best CPUs for Workstations" and "Best CPUs for Gaming" articles, and choose a platform. Probably going to be Ryzen 7 vs. X299, and you'll probably get at least one more CPU upgrade from either of these motherboards. Get an NVMe Samsung 960 Evo or Pro because fast storage is super important and these are currently blowing everything else out of the water. Get enough RAM for now, and leave a slot or two free for when the prices for DDR4 drop. Pick your graphics card from the spectrum, or honestly, just keep using whatever you have right now because cryptocurrency is currently severely distorting the market and limiting availability. I don't see a "Best graphics card" summary article right now, but I think this chart is somewhat current: AMD Price NVIDIA RX Vega 64 $500 GeForce GTX 1080 $450 GeForce GTX 1070 RX Vega 56 $400 RX 580 (8GB) $300 GeForce GTX 1060 (6GB) RX 580 (4GB) $200 RX 570 $170/$180 GeForce GTX 1060 3GB $130 GeForce GTX 1050 Ti RX 460 $100/$105 GeForce GTX 1050 The most important thing to understand is that getting the exact ideal processor doesn't really matter. The difference between competing processors will only be discernible with a stopwatch and carefully controlled tests.

Kayou 9y ago

Basically, IPC in an Intel core is a bit better than in an AMD core. Keeping this in mind, you can compare core counts, frequency, power draw, PCIe lines or whatever floats your boat. To compensate for a lower IPC, AMD will give you more cores (sometimes a lot) for the same price. It all depends of what you need your processing power for.

theandrewbailey 9y ago

What are you doing? Gaming? Rendering? Video editing? Compiling?

ccalvert 9y ago
Not sure about SeanDav, but I do a lot of compiling and wonder if anyone has any suggestions about the best CPU to buy. I want short wait times for a compile, but I still care about price. I don't want to go over $500 but would prefer less.
- dman 9y ago
  Look at the Ryzen 1700X. Its a full fledged 8 core and down to 299 (https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B06X3W9NGG/55467-20/ref=gb1h_img_m-3_3342_169dd9fc?smid=AANSFONOCR8T3&psc=1&pf_rd_m=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_s=merchandised-search-3 https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B06X3W9NGG/55467-20/...). Dont think Intel has something that comes close to that for compile times at that price point (If someone has a counter point on this I would love to be corrected).
  - shadowfacts 9y ago
    If you're willing to overclock, the 1700 would be a bit better as the price is a bit lower and it can hit the same clock speeds (after OCing).
    - loeg 9y ago
      It's worth noting that not all 1700s can hit the 1700X or 1800X speeds. There is a degree of luck in overclocking. Also, it's only a useful suggestion if you don't mind losing your warranty.
- phaedrus 9y ago
  My experience with GCC and compiling C++ has been that performance scales nearly linearly with core count. In other words, compiling C++ gets great benefits from parallelism - provided you configure your build to take advantage of it. (For make use the -j N option where N=num cores + 1; for Code::Blocks it is a preferences option. Not sure about Visual Studio.) Things that do not parallelize: the final linking step (especially with mingw), compilation if all your code is one giant CPP file (prefer small files). Assuming you have an SSD, your project is configured for parallel build, and your code is organized into many small CPP files, more cores == more better. I look for the highest core count CPUs with the lowest power. Last year I built a dual CPU Xeon workstation / home server using 1.8 GHz 14-core chips (mostly from second-hand used hardware to save money). I feel that that low clock speed is actually an advantage, because even with 2 sockets and 8 sticks of 8 Gb RAM, it idles at only 75W (at the outlet, as measured with a Kill-a-Watt). With 56 total threads, it builds my C++ project in 2.0 seconds flat, something which takes almost 2 minutes single-threaded. (I think the fact that there are 60 seconds in a minute, that 56 ~= 60, and that the build time went from 2 minutes to 2 seconds is not coincidental.) Unfortunately a hardware problem with one of the used components seems to be causing the machine to lock up under Linux, and I never had the time to troubleshoot it, and moved on to a different codebase which doesn't require as much compilation so haven't yet had motivation to track down the problem.
  - BeetleB 9y ago
    Keep in mind that with more parallelism, the memory consumption goes up as well. That should be included in cost considerations.

Symmetry 9y ago

Looking at the ~$375-$400 price point, the new 6 core Intel 8700k will compile large C projects ever so slightly faster[1] and might be faster or slower for games depending on which one and othe details. [2][3] I'd tend to go with AMD right now just because they don't play tricks with fusing off certain functions for market segmentation reasons. Basically, look at independent benchmarks close to what you're doing. For choosing everything else many websites put together system guides laying out a set of compatible components they think are good at the same part of the market. Those tend to be very gaming focused but I think that's a good starting point. Intel just released a new top end chip so they're all out of date but the recommendations here[4] are where I'd advise you to look if you want a new system now. The prices have come down a bit since the guide was written, though. Or there's the Build a PC subreddit wiki as an information resource. [5] [1]https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=intel-coffee-8700k&num=6 https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=intel-co... [2]https://www.anandtech.com/show/11859/the-anandtech-coffee-lake-review-8700k-and-8400-initial-numbers/13 https://www.anandtech.com/show/11859/the-anandtech-coffee-la... [3]http://techreport.com/review/32642/intel-core-i7-8700k-cpu-reviewed/6 http://techreport.com/review/32642/intel-core-i7-8700k-cpu-r... [4]http://techreport.com/review/32474/the-tech-report-system-guide-september-2017-edition http://techreport.com/review/32474/the-tech-report-system-gu... [5]https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/wiki/index https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/wiki/index

fencepost 9y ago

IIRC it started as a "compiled wisdom of 4chan gaming boards" and has morphed into affiliate links, but you might still find the Logical Increments list useful (http://www.logicalincrements.com/ http://www.logicalincrements.com/)

nfriedly 9y ago

http://www.logicalincrements.com/ http://www.logicalincrements.com/ is a handy site that recommends PC builds that give you a good bang-for-buck at various price points. On a given horizontal line, the CPU, motherboard, and RAM will all be compatible. The site is tilted for gaming, but GPUs are mostly interchangeable - so if you want more compute power, you can drop to a lower GPU and spend the money on the CPU instead.

ksk 9y ago
That is a great website ! It would be nice if they also offered/crowdsourced benchmarks.
nfriedly 9y ago
Oh, and the #1 upgrade you can make for everyday use is a SSD. I was recently impressed at just how fast an old Core 2 Duo system was once I installed an SSD. It won't do much for gaming (aside from improving load times), but it will make the rest of the things you do on the computer more pleasant.

ksk 9y ago

I think the best option for you is to just buy a new machine from Dell or something. They've done all that work for you !

seanalltogether 9y ago

I built an always on but mostly idle side computer (gaming, storage, media server) from this guide and I couldn't be happier. https://techbuyersguru.com/1250-quiet-gaming-pc-build https://techbuyersguru.com/1250-quiet-gaming-pc-build The best part is I never hear it, even when gaming the fans seem to barely kick in.

LeifCarrotson 9y ago

Honestly, Anandtech's linked "Best X" articles are one of the best resources for this on the web. Compare their "Best CPUs for Workstations" and "Best CPUs for Gaming" articles, and choose a platform. Probably going to be Ryzen 7 vs. X299, and you'll probably get at least one more CPU upgrade from either of these motherboards. Get an NVMe Samsung 960 Evo or Pro because fast storage is super important and these are currently blowing everything else out of the water. Get enough RAM for now, and leave a slot or two free for when the prices for DDR4 drop. Pick your graphics card from the spectrum, or honestly, just keep using whatever you have right now because cryptocurrency is currently severely distorting the market and limiting availability. I don't see a "Best graphics card" summary article right now, but I think this chart is somewhat current: AMD Price NVIDIA RX Vega 64 $500 GeForce GTX 1080 $450 GeForce GTX 1070 RX Vega 56 $400 RX 580 (8GB) $300 GeForce GTX 1060 (6GB) RX 580 (4GB) $200 RX 570 $170/$180 GeForce GTX 1060 3GB $130 GeForce GTX 1050 Ti RX 460 $100/$105 GeForce GTX 1050 The most important thing to understand is that getting the exact ideal processor doesn't really matter. The difference between competing processors will only be discernible with a stopwatch and carefully controlled tests.