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He seems to have led a winderful and impactful life but it's a little shocking when so many people in the news, who seemingly led healthy lives, pass away in th

He seems to have led a winderful and impactful life but it's a little shocking when so many people in the news, who seemingly led healthy lives, pass away in their 60s . :( Why is this happening?

athenot 9y ago
If the average life expectancy in the US is 78 years, that means there are plenty of people who might live to be 90, perhaps even beyond 100 and many who will die anywhere between childhood and that average number. Sadly, many interpret this to be that they will live to be that magic average number, and either get caught off-guard when time is up sooner (perhaps regretting having neglected family time / travel / personal stuff), or unprepared in the case they live 20 years beyond what their savings had projected to last.
- rootbear 9y ago
  My mother, who turns 97 today, is utterly astonished that she's still alive.
  - jameskegel 9y ago
    Is she fairly active? I've noticed over the years, the ones that just refuse to stop moving just keep going, for the most part.
    - yeukhon 9y ago
      I second this. I know a lot of elders who are fairly active outdoor and indoor seem to do better, much like plants need sunlight and fresh air. My grandma used to live in China by herself and her parish was only a few doors down. When she finally came to live with us in the U.S., she still go to church every morning, but she has to walk two blocks. After a few months, her walking has improved, and crane is now optional on the good sunny days. She eats well too (compared to what she would eat in China..) She's 88 years old today. For many years, Chinese elders are recommended to go to senior citizen clubs, play chess games and Mahjong, do TaiChi or something alike, for better physical and mental health. The unfortunate side of the reality is many elders are disabled and have no one to get them where they need to be except getting help from senior assistance. I hope more families can spend more time with their elderly.
    - frozenport 9y ago
      Problem here is that many can't move due to injury or similiar.
    - Scarblac 9y ago
      On the other hand there are also those people who are quite active and just don't wake up some morning in their early 40s.
      - noir_lord 9y ago
        I don't fear death, I fear suffering before it. I'm less concerned with when I punch out than with how I punch out. The thing that scares me more than physical infirmity (and I can say this with a degree of certainty since I have a serious spine condition that at one point could have meant a wheelchair) is mental infirmity. Terry Pratchett (and others) had it right, We should be allowed to choose our end time while we are in sound mind. That we don't have Euthanasia in most 'modern' societies I think is insane.
        EdSharkey 9y ago
        > That we don't have Euthanasia in most 'modern' societies I think is insane. An insanely complex and thorny issue, maybe. I would argue that once preserving life is negotiable, a debate on the utility of the elderly and infirmed soon follows. Ruthless bureaucratic directives will simply roll off the tongue like, "maybe your mother should just take a pain pill", if you recall that ol' chestnut from prez. Obama. So, if you want to institutionalize murdering inconvenient people, go ahead and make your case. I'll oppose such self-hating foolishness. If you do get your way, don't be surprised when you're powerless and some bean counter unceremoniously pulls your plug before you're ready to go, just to free up a bed.
        noir_lord 9y ago
        You didn't so much as step onto that slippery slope as strap on some ski's and make it an Olympic event. > An insanely complex and thorny issue, maybe. So are most major issues society has to deal with. > I would argue that once preserving life is negotiable, a debate on the utility of the elderly and infirmed soon follows. Perhaps but we already have that debate every time the government decides how much money to put into elderly care (hint: In my country (the UK) not as much as they should - Social Care for the elderly is critically underfunded) > So, if you want to institutionalize murdering inconvenient people. Not sure how you got there from my post but for what it is worth, I don't - I want the opinion of the person in sound mind backed up by competent medical professionals to be respected as a matter of body autonomy, We don't get to force surgery on adults of sound mind for example and here in the UK other things are regulated in a similar system - I can choose not to have surgery that will kill me if I don't have it, that's fine but I can't choose the manner of my death, it seems contradictory to me, We put animals that are suffering to sleep because it's humane but we don't extend the same right to humans who are capable of asking for it and yes there are arguments against but nothing is perfect, the question I always ask is "in aggregate does this benefit people" if you wait around for the perfect solution you end up not implementing a 'merely' better one. > If you do get your way, don't be surprised when you're powerless and some bean counter unceremoniously pulls your plug before you're ready to go, just to free up a bed. And if we don't, don't be surprised when the secret Martian master race turn up and harvest your essence....
    - sbierwagen 9y ago
      http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/644554 http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/644554 >Survival increased across the full range of gait speeds, with significant increments per 0.1 m/s. At age 75, predicted 10-year survival across the range of gait speeds ranged from 19% to 87% in men and from 35% to 91% in women. Predicted survival based on age, sex, and gait speed was as accurate as predicted based on age, sex, use of mobility aids, and self-reported function or as age, sex, chronic conditions, smoking history, blood pressure, body mass index, and hospitalization. Graph of life expectancy vs gait speed: http://jamanetwork.com/data/Journals/JAMA/8042/joc05171f2.png http://jamanetwork.com/data/Journals/JAMA/8042/joc05171f2.pn... Table with confidence intervals: http://jamanetwork.com/data/Journals/JAMA/8042/joc05171t2.png http://jamanetwork.com/data/Journals/JAMA/8042/joc05171t2.pn...
    - irrational 9y ago
      I visited my 95 year old grandmother this past Sunday. She was up and moving around the entire time except when sitting down to eat the delicious lunch she had insisted on cooking for us. Her hearing is starting to go, but her eyesight is still fine and her mental faculties are razor sharp. She still lives on her own and can get around just fine. Part of it is surely genetic. Her father lived to be nearly 105 and was 100% healthy physically and mentally until 2 weeks before he died when he developed shingles and got sores in his mouth that made it difficult to eat so he stopped eating and died. He was still breaking horses into his late-80s. I also wonder if it was something to do with how she was raised. She grew up on a ranch and spent a lot of time outdoors tending the cows and sheep We were visiting the old property this summer and she told us we should go on a hike to see a waterfall up a canyon where she once had to retrieve a flock of lost sheep - it was one of the most difficult hikes I've ever been on and I can't believe she did it and brought back the sheep while still a young girl. They made them tougher back in those days I guess.
      - mixmastamyk 9y ago
        Depends if you are in good shape or not, makes a bigger difference than is obvious.
      - azinman2 9y ago
        My grandfather on one side was a farmer and lived to 88. My other grandfather was a pharmacist in Pittsburgh, lived amongst all its coal pollution and not particularly active in the same way, and he lived to 100.
    - rootbear 9y ago
      She isn't active now, but up until a few years ago, she was the primary caregiver for my father, who had Alzheimer's. It kept her busy. She also spent a lot of time on fixing healthy food.
    - ianamartin 9y ago
      I think that has something to do with it. My dad is 98 and lives a pretty active lifestyle. He jogs 5 miles a day and runs a hobby farm with chickens and sheep and a few acres of vegetables. But some of it has to be genetic too. His older sister is 106, and my grandmother was 102 when she passed. It’s kind of amazing to be my age and have a dad who was born in 1919 and a grandma born in 1882. I’m grateful for having that much knowledge and experience around me. There are things I’ve allegedly missed out on by having an older dad, but I wouldn’t trade my experience for anything.
      - 20kleagues 9y ago
        Just out of curiosity, how old are you?
        ianamartin 9y ago
        38
- phkahler 9y ago
  >> Sadly, many interpret this to be that they will live to be that magic average number... And some of us have the notion that money can push your date out further. Then we see CEOs die "early" and realize nobody is an exception.
  - akgerber 9y ago
    It pushes the average date out further. Just not everyone's.
  - johnny99 9y ago
    Well, money, and the concomitant access to things like good health care it provides, certainly tilts the board in your favor.
sliverstorm 9y ago
Totally unscientific, but I think it's conspicuous that is right around retirement. Maybe people who are living on sheer determination lose their purpose. Maybe people who need to be busy are suddenly bored out of their minds. Maybe work kept them moving, and without it they tanked quickly. I have no real proof, but I'll be prodding my father to find a side job or volunteer work or a really deep hobby as he approaches retirement.
- CryptoPunk 9y ago
  If what you say about deaths rising after retirement is true, it could be the loss of a routine. I suspect (and I also have no evidence for this) that a routine, honed over many years, is important to health. Also, loneliness is highly correlated with increased chance of death. The end of work life could significantly increase loneliness.
  - vasilipupkin 9y ago
    or you know, it could have nothing to do with these handwavy claims and instead, he may have had a terminal illness, in part triggered by years of extreme stress and super hard work.
- evo 9y ago
  How do you disentangle the correlation, though? Is it not also possible that a driven person retires because, perhaps subconsciously, they recognize symptoms that both impair their continued performance and portend their imminent demise?
  - sliverstorm 9y ago
    Simple, 65 is the standard retirement age and has been for a long time now, while longevity patterns have shifted.
- irrational 9y ago
  My father is a doctor. He is in his 70s and works 60 hour weeks at the Native American reservation clinic that he started working at after he retired and built his dream home out in the middle of nowhere. He claims that a 60 hour work week is retirement for a doctor. He certainly doesn't need the money, but says he will continue showing up at the clinic till he dies.

He seems to have led a winderful and impactful life but it's a little shocking when so many people in the news, who seemingly led healthy lives, pass away in their 60s . :( Why is this happening?

athenot 9y ago

If the average life expectancy in the US is 78 years, that means there are plenty of people who might live to be 90, perhaps even beyond 100 and many who will die anywhere between childhood and that average number. Sadly, many interpret this to be that they will live to be that magic average number, and either get caught off-guard when time is up sooner (perhaps regretting having neglected family time / travel / personal stuff), or unprepared in the case they live 20 years beyond what their savings had projected to last.

rootbear 9y ago
My mother, who turns 97 today, is utterly astonished that she's still alive.
- jameskegel 9y ago
  Is she fairly active? I've noticed over the years, the ones that just refuse to stop moving just keep going, for the most part.
  - yeukhon 9y ago
    I second this. I know a lot of elders who are fairly active outdoor and indoor seem to do better, much like plants need sunlight and fresh air. My grandma used to live in China by herself and her parish was only a few doors down. When she finally came to live with us in the U.S., she still go to church every morning, but she has to walk two blocks. After a few months, her walking has improved, and crane is now optional on the good sunny days. She eats well too (compared to what she would eat in China..) She's 88 years old today. For many years, Chinese elders are recommended to go to senior citizen clubs, play chess games and Mahjong, do TaiChi or something alike, for better physical and mental health. The unfortunate side of the reality is many elders are disabled and have no one to get them where they need to be except getting help from senior assistance. I hope more families can spend more time with their elderly.
  - frozenport 9y ago
    Problem here is that many can't move due to injury or similiar.
  - Scarblac 9y ago
    On the other hand there are also those people who are quite active and just don't wake up some morning in their early 40s.
    - noir_lord 9y ago
      I don't fear death, I fear suffering before it. I'm less concerned with when I punch out than with how I punch out. The thing that scares me more than physical infirmity (and I can say this with a degree of certainty since I have a serious spine condition that at one point could have meant a wheelchair) is mental infirmity. Terry Pratchett (and others) had it right, We should be allowed to choose our end time while we are in sound mind. That we don't have Euthanasia in most 'modern' societies I think is insane.
      - EdSharkey 9y ago
        > That we don't have Euthanasia in most 'modern' societies I think is insane. An insanely complex and thorny issue, maybe. I would argue that once preserving life is negotiable, a debate on the utility of the elderly and infirmed soon follows. Ruthless bureaucratic directives will simply roll off the tongue like, "maybe your mother should just take a pain pill", if you recall that ol' chestnut from prez. Obama. So, if you want to institutionalize murdering inconvenient people, go ahead and make your case. I'll oppose such self-hating foolishness. If you do get your way, don't be surprised when you're powerless and some bean counter unceremoniously pulls your plug before you're ready to go, just to free up a bed.
        noir_lord 9y ago
        You didn't so much as step onto that slippery slope as strap on some ski's and make it an Olympic event. > An insanely complex and thorny issue, maybe. So are most major issues society has to deal with. > I would argue that once preserving life is negotiable, a debate on the utility of the elderly and infirmed soon follows. Perhaps but we already have that debate every time the government decides how much money to put into elderly care (hint: In my country (the UK) not as much as they should - Social Care for the elderly is critically underfunded) > So, if you want to institutionalize murdering inconvenient people. Not sure how you got there from my post but for what it is worth, I don't - I want the opinion of the person in sound mind backed up by competent medical professionals to be respected as a matter of body autonomy, We don't get to force surgery on adults of sound mind for example and here in the UK other things are regulated in a similar system - I can choose not to have surgery that will kill me if I don't have it, that's fine but I can't choose the manner of my death, it seems contradictory to me, We put animals that are suffering to sleep because it's humane but we don't extend the same right to humans who are capable of asking for it and yes there are arguments against but nothing is perfect, the question I always ask is "in aggregate does this benefit people" if you wait around for the perfect solution you end up not implementing a 'merely' better one. > If you do get your way, don't be surprised when you're powerless and some bean counter unceremoniously pulls your plug before you're ready to go, just to free up a bed. And if we don't, don't be surprised when the secret Martian master race turn up and harvest your essence....
  - sbierwagen 9y ago
    http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/644554 http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/644554 >Survival increased across the full range of gait speeds, with significant increments per 0.1 m/s. At age 75, predicted 10-year survival across the range of gait speeds ranged from 19% to 87% in men and from 35% to 91% in women. Predicted survival based on age, sex, and gait speed was as accurate as predicted based on age, sex, use of mobility aids, and self-reported function or as age, sex, chronic conditions, smoking history, blood pressure, body mass index, and hospitalization. Graph of life expectancy vs gait speed: http://jamanetwork.com/data/Journals/JAMA/8042/joc05171f2.png http://jamanetwork.com/data/Journals/JAMA/8042/joc05171f2.pn... Table with confidence intervals: http://jamanetwork.com/data/Journals/JAMA/8042/joc05171t2.png http://jamanetwork.com/data/Journals/JAMA/8042/joc05171t2.pn...
  - irrational 9y ago
    I visited my 95 year old grandmother this past Sunday. She was up and moving around the entire time except when sitting down to eat the delicious lunch she had insisted on cooking for us. Her hearing is starting to go, but her eyesight is still fine and her mental faculties are razor sharp. She still lives on her own and can get around just fine. Part of it is surely genetic. Her father lived to be nearly 105 and was 100% healthy physically and mentally until 2 weeks before he died when he developed shingles and got sores in his mouth that made it difficult to eat so he stopped eating and died. He was still breaking horses into his late-80s. I also wonder if it was something to do with how she was raised. She grew up on a ranch and spent a lot of time outdoors tending the cows and sheep We were visiting the old property this summer and she told us we should go on a hike to see a waterfall up a canyon where she once had to retrieve a flock of lost sheep - it was one of the most difficult hikes I've ever been on and I can't believe she did it and brought back the sheep while still a young girl. They made them tougher back in those days I guess.
    - mixmastamyk 9y ago
      Depends if you are in good shape or not, makes a bigger difference than is obvious.
    - azinman2 9y ago
      My grandfather on one side was a farmer and lived to 88. My other grandfather was a pharmacist in Pittsburgh, lived amongst all its coal pollution and not particularly active in the same way, and he lived to 100.
  - rootbear 9y ago
    She isn't active now, but up until a few years ago, she was the primary caregiver for my father, who had Alzheimer's. It kept her busy. She also spent a lot of time on fixing healthy food.
  - ianamartin 9y ago
    I think that has something to do with it. My dad is 98 and lives a pretty active lifestyle. He jogs 5 miles a day and runs a hobby farm with chickens and sheep and a few acres of vegetables. But some of it has to be genetic too. His older sister is 106, and my grandmother was 102 when she passed. It’s kind of amazing to be my age and have a dad who was born in 1919 and a grandma born in 1882. I’m grateful for having that much knowledge and experience around me. There are things I’ve allegedly missed out on by having an older dad, but I wouldn’t trade my experience for anything.
    - 20kleagues 9y ago
      Just out of curiosity, how old are you?
      - ianamartin 9y ago
        38
phkahler 9y ago
>> Sadly, many interpret this to be that they will live to be that magic average number... And some of us have the notion that money can push your date out further. Then we see CEOs die "early" and realize nobody is an exception.
- akgerber 9y ago
  It pushes the average date out further. Just not everyone's.
- johnny99 9y ago
  Well, money, and the concomitant access to things like good health care it provides, certainly tilts the board in your favor.

sliverstorm 9y ago

Totally unscientific, but I think it's conspicuous that is right around retirement. Maybe people who are living on sheer determination lose their purpose. Maybe people who need to be busy are suddenly bored out of their minds. Maybe work kept them moving, and without it they tanked quickly. I have no real proof, but I'll be prodding my father to find a side job or volunteer work or a really deep hobby as he approaches retirement.

CryptoPunk 9y ago
If what you say about deaths rising after retirement is true, it could be the loss of a routine. I suspect (and I also have no evidence for this) that a routine, honed over many years, is important to health. Also, loneliness is highly correlated with increased chance of death. The end of work life could significantly increase loneliness.
- vasilipupkin 9y ago
  or you know, it could have nothing to do with these handwavy claims and instead, he may have had a terminal illness, in part triggered by years of extreme stress and super hard work.
evo 9y ago
How do you disentangle the correlation, though? Is it not also possible that a driven person retires because, perhaps subconsciously, they recognize symptoms that both impair their continued performance and portend their imminent demise?
- sliverstorm 9y ago
  Simple, 65 is the standard retirement age and has been for a long time now, while longevity patterns have shifted.
irrational 9y ago
My father is a doctor. He is in his 70s and works 60 hour weeks at the Native American reservation clinic that he started working at after he retired and built his dream home out in the middle of nowhere. He claims that a 60 hour work week is retirement for a doctor. He certainly doesn't need the money, but says he will continue showing up at the clinic till he dies.