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Spain has an independent judiciary. In China, and I guess also Venezuela although I know less about it, the judiciary is heavily influenced by the government.

by gpvos 9y ago

Spain has an independent judiciary. In China, and I guess also Venezuela although I know less about it, the judiciary is heavily influenced by the government. Of course their governments see that as the way it should be. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_law#Rule_of_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_law#Rule_of_law : > Despite the newly elevated role of courts in Chinese society, there still remains some consensus about defects in China's legal system in regards to progressing towards the rule of law. I have never read anything similar about Spain.

ryanlol 9y ago
>Spain has an independent judiciary. http://en.administracion.gob.es/pag_Home/espanaAdmon/comoSeOrganizaEstado/Institucionesl_Estado/PoderJudicial.html http://en.administracion.gob.es/pag_Home/espanaAdmon/comoSeO... >Parliament approves the budget of the judiciary. "Independent" is a strong word here.
- euyyn 9y ago
  The judiciary in Spain sentenced a Ministro del Interior (the 2nd most powerful political position after President) to 10 years in prison. All western democracies have the executive branch influence the judiciary in more or less degree. But it's a huge jump from that to single-party systems like China or, de facto, Venezuela.
  - wott 9y ago
    > The judiciary in Spain sentenced a Ministro del Interior (the 2nd most powerful political position after President) to 10 years in prison. And now, please inform us of how long this murderer actually served, just for the laugh. Was it 1 year? 6 months? 3 months? And for even more laugh, just tell us how his sentence vanished, thanks to... the government's pardon. Your example is going against your point!
    - euyyn 9y ago
      Most if not all western democracies give the Government the power to pardon convicts. It's one of the checks the three branches have against each other. I, along with the vast majority of Spaniards, agree that it's been abused and should be restricted. But if your argument is that the courts in all these countries are puppets of their governments based on the fact that they have the power to pardon later on, I don't think it's a strong argument.
throwaway613834 9y ago
I don't really see why you must have an independent judiciary to have rule of law. It's obviously good, but as far as I'm aware, rule of law is merely about the fact that the law applies to everyone. I don't think it says anything about how a court system (if it even needs to exist) should function? In an extreme case, if your Supreme Court was completely independent (i.e. no impeachment risk, which we don't have in the US) but had only 1 justice on it, then he would essentially be the dictator, since he could interpret any law to mean anything, and his decision would need to stand.

by gpvos 9y ago

ryanlol 9y ago

>Spain has an independent judiciary. http://en.administracion.gob.es/pag_Home/espanaAdmon/comoSeOrganizaEstado/Institucionesl_Estado/PoderJudicial.html http://en.administracion.gob.es/pag_Home/espanaAdmon/comoSeO... >Parliament approves the budget of the judiciary. "Independent" is a strong word here.

euyyn 9y ago
The judiciary in Spain sentenced a Ministro del Interior (the 2nd most powerful political position after President) to 10 years in prison. All western democracies have the executive branch influence the judiciary in more or less degree. But it's a huge jump from that to single-party systems like China or, de facto, Venezuela.
- wott 9y ago
  > The judiciary in Spain sentenced a Ministro del Interior (the 2nd most powerful political position after President) to 10 years in prison. And now, please inform us of how long this murderer actually served, just for the laugh. Was it 1 year? 6 months? 3 months? And for even more laugh, just tell us how his sentence vanished, thanks to... the government's pardon. Your example is going against your point!
  - euyyn 9y ago
    Most if not all western democracies give the Government the power to pardon convicts. It's one of the checks the three branches have against each other. I, along with the vast majority of Spaniards, agree that it's been abused and should be restricted. But if your argument is that the courts in all these countries are puppets of their governments based on the fact that they have the power to pardon later on, I don't think it's a strong argument.

throwaway613834 9y ago

I don't really see why you must have an independent judiciary to have rule of law. It's obviously good, but as far as I'm aware, rule of law is merely about the fact that the law applies to everyone. I don't think it says anything about how a court system (if it even needs to exist) should function? In an extreme case, if your Supreme Court was completely independent (i.e. no impeachment risk, which we don't have in the US) but had only 1 justice on it, then he would essentially be the dictator, since he could interpret any law to mean anything, and his decision would need to stand.