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Military dictatorships are responsible for the atrocities you mention. Not communism. Evil people. Atrocities have also happened in capitalist counties - we're

Military dictatorships are responsible for the atrocities you mention. Not communism. Evil people. Atrocities have also happened in capitalist counties - we're not placing the blame for those on the style of market the government chooses to adapt and it would be idiotic to do so.

selectodude 9y ago
There isn't a single communist country that wasn't a dictatorship. There are plenty of capitalist societies that aren't dictatorships. I find these discussions always fly into the "no true scotsman" fallacy.
- k-mcgrady 9y ago
  Are you saying communism cannot exist separately from (evil) dictator? Lots of the ideas do (there are plenty of functioning highly socialist countries). Theoretically at least communism could exist peacefully (although it seems you would need everyone in the country to agree and remain agreed to the principals for that to work). Also - dictatorships can work. There have been several 'benevolent' dictators who made communism work without introducing any more evil than many democratically elected leaders. A dictatorship doesn't naturally lead to Mao/Stalin etc.
  - teilo 9y ago
    This is the same tired argument: "But communism would work if people did it right." This is neither an historical nor a scientific argument. It is pure wide-eyed ideology that ignores the devastation that communism has caused everywhere it has been tried. Communism = oppression, poverty, and starvation.
  - jules 9y ago
    > Are you saying communism cannot exist separately from (evil) dictator? History does seem to bear that out.
    - k-mcgrady 9y ago
      Around 100 years of history isn't a big sample size when it comes to political/economic ideologies. Also, I would argue their are examples of it existing with non-evil dictators. I won't bother naming anyone specifically as it's easy to say 'but x did y' however I feel like that applies to a majority of world leaders under any system. There are certainly leaders of communist countries who did no-more evil than some of our recent democratically elected leaders in the west.
      - selectodude 9y ago
        What examples can you come up with?
      - jules 9y ago
        There have been many attempts at communism and it has had a 100% rate of ending in dictatorship. Which of those dictators would you consider non-evil? Should we want dictatorship, even if the the dictator is non-evil? Given the absurdly bad consequences in many cases and the fact that it's not all that surprising that an ideology like communism ends in dictatorship, I'd suggest that trying it again is not very wise. > There are certainly leaders of communist countries who did no-more evil than some of our recent democratically elected leaders in the west. What if they had the most powerful army in the world at their disposal?

selectodude 9y ago

There isn't a single communist country that wasn't a dictatorship. There are plenty of capitalist societies that aren't dictatorships. I find these discussions always fly into the "no true scotsman" fallacy.

k-mcgrady 9y ago
Are you saying communism cannot exist separately from (evil) dictator? Lots of the ideas do (there are plenty of functioning highly socialist countries). Theoretically at least communism could exist peacefully (although it seems you would need everyone in the country to agree and remain agreed to the principals for that to work). Also - dictatorships can work. There have been several 'benevolent' dictators who made communism work without introducing any more evil than many democratically elected leaders. A dictatorship doesn't naturally lead to Mao/Stalin etc.
- teilo 9y ago
  This is the same tired argument: "But communism would work if people did it right." This is neither an historical nor a scientific argument. It is pure wide-eyed ideology that ignores the devastation that communism has caused everywhere it has been tried. Communism = oppression, poverty, and starvation.
- jules 9y ago
  > Are you saying communism cannot exist separately from (evil) dictator? History does seem to bear that out.
  - k-mcgrady 9y ago
    Around 100 years of history isn't a big sample size when it comes to political/economic ideologies. Also, I would argue their are examples of it existing with non-evil dictators. I won't bother naming anyone specifically as it's easy to say 'but x did y' however I feel like that applies to a majority of world leaders under any system. There are certainly leaders of communist countries who did no-more evil than some of our recent democratically elected leaders in the west.
    - selectodude 9y ago
      What examples can you come up with?
    - jules 9y ago
      There have been many attempts at communism and it has had a 100% rate of ending in dictatorship. Which of those dictators would you consider non-evil? Should we want dictatorship, even if the the dictator is non-evil? Given the absurdly bad consequences in many cases and the fact that it's not all that surprising that an ideology like communism ends in dictatorship, I'd suggest that trying it again is not very wise. > There are certainly leaders of communist countries who did no-more evil than some of our recent democratically elected leaders in the west. What if they had the most powerful army in the world at their disposal?