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My experience has been that jumping from employee to any level of executive is the absolute hardest step, at least for me. I think once you are a team lead and

My experience has been that jumping from employee to any level of executive is the absolute hardest step, at least for me. I think once you are a team lead and have some number of direct reports, you can then start jumping your way up that ladder. But going from 0 to 5 direct reports has often seemed impossible. I'd be open to tips on how to do it.

mratzloff 9y ago
It's something you're doing that's limiting you. Find a mentor or career coach. Someone with plenty of management experience. They'll help you discover what that is and how you can fix it.
- JimboOmega 9y ago
  Given the prevalence of the methods discussed in the OP, that's kind of hard to do; e.g. I work for the CTO who is the co-founder, but doesn't have a strong management background. Recommend a place to start?
  - sshumaker 9y ago
    The problem probably isn't with you, it's with your environment. It's likely you're at the wrong company (see my comment above). If you work directly for the CTO my guess is that there aren't a lot of management opportunities at your current employer, period.
    - mratzloff 9y ago
      In which case the self-limiting thing he's doing is remaining with his current employer. Look for a new job with the goal in mind of finding a mentor.
sshumaker 9y ago
A manager isn't an executive. In addition to new skills, there are also mental shifts necessary at various stages in your career, as you climb to increasing levels of leadership. You can see this on the IC track as well for top-tier tech companies - there is a step-function difference in mindset at certain levels. Jumping from IC to line manager, as you suggest, is one; you need to recognize you are no longer shipping code but are shipping your team - they are your output, and their performance is how you are measured. At director it switches again, you are responsible not precisely for the people but for your organization as a whole. There is an adage that you know you're a director after your first re-org and are moving people's names around as cells on a spreadsheet. It changes again at VP, as an executive of the company you are responsible and accountable for an entire function. Excuses cease to matter, even external forces - you should have accounted for them. You are optimizing for the company's overall future and not your org or people. This is a vastly simplified explanation, obviously.
- JimboOmega 9y ago
  You're saying what's necessary to do the job, not what's necessary to get it - which is my bigger problem. I don't feel that I want to remain an IC forever; become a true technical expert and honing that skill further is not a path that I personally want to focus on
  - sshumaker 9y ago
    Ahh, that's fairly straightforward. Join a rapidly growing organization and stand out as an IC. You'll inevitably be asked to take on a bigger role as the org struggles with leadership gaps as they expand.
  - shostack 9y ago
    The way to break free from the IC mold generally takes a combination of a few things: 1. Interest in growing which you make known to those above you. 2. Available positions (hard to grow into a manager when there is no manager role available or budget to support one) 3. Understanding the difference between "strategy" and "tactics." They mean very different things, and as a manager, depending on the size company, you may be responsible for setting the strategy while your team executes on tactics. 4. A demonstrated willingness and ability to put the company first and protect it. There is a lot of debate on this one and what it means, but generally those who do this get ahead faster than ones who don't, regardless of your viewpoints on whether that is right or not. 5. A growing focus on process and where you team fits in with the rest of the company. By focusing on this, you can find ways to improve team efficiency and performance, and better interface with other departments. As a manager, your job is literally to improve the efficiency and performance of your team and be the glue to other teams.
ryandrake 9y ago
I've found that going from zero to one direct reports is the toughest step (still trying to get there) on the ladder.
- JimboOmega 9y ago
  I had one for about 6 months, though it didn't do me much good later on.
harryh 9y ago
> I'd be open to tips on how to do it. Some things that can help (in no particular order): - excel in your role as an IC - Take on leadership responsibilities in your role as an IC. Don't just do stuff, own things - Work in a growing organization in constant need of new leadership - Take the initiative to start something new that succeeds to the point that you need additional help to keep it going - Mentor an intern - Ask your manager for leadership responsibilities - Be connected enough to the wider organization that you know when opportunities arise on adjacent teams and leaders of those teams know you well enough to think of you when filling them

mratzloff 9y ago

It's something you're doing that's limiting you. Find a mentor or career coach. Someone with plenty of management experience. They'll help you discover what that is and how you can fix it.

JimboOmega 9y ago
Given the prevalence of the methods discussed in the OP, that's kind of hard to do; e.g. I work for the CTO who is the co-founder, but doesn't have a strong management background. Recommend a place to start?
- sshumaker 9y ago
  The problem probably isn't with you, it's with your environment. It's likely you're at the wrong company (see my comment above). If you work directly for the CTO my guess is that there aren't a lot of management opportunities at your current employer, period.
  - mratzloff 9y ago
    In which case the self-limiting thing he's doing is remaining with his current employer. Look for a new job with the goal in mind of finding a mentor.

sshumaker 9y ago

A manager isn't an executive. In addition to new skills, there are also mental shifts necessary at various stages in your career, as you climb to increasing levels of leadership. You can see this on the IC track as well for top-tier tech companies - there is a step-function difference in mindset at certain levels. Jumping from IC to line manager, as you suggest, is one; you need to recognize you are no longer shipping code but are shipping your team - they are your output, and their performance is how you are measured. At director it switches again, you are responsible not precisely for the people but for your organization as a whole. There is an adage that you know you're a director after your first re-org and are moving people's names around as cells on a spreadsheet. It changes again at VP, as an executive of the company you are responsible and accountable for an entire function. Excuses cease to matter, even external forces - you should have accounted for them. You are optimizing for the company's overall future and not your org or people. This is a vastly simplified explanation, obviously.

JimboOmega 9y ago
You're saying what's necessary to do the job, not what's necessary to get it - which is my bigger problem. I don't feel that I want to remain an IC forever; become a true technical expert and honing that skill further is not a path that I personally want to focus on
- sshumaker 9y ago
  Ahh, that's fairly straightforward. Join a rapidly growing organization and stand out as an IC. You'll inevitably be asked to take on a bigger role as the org struggles with leadership gaps as they expand.
- shostack 9y ago
  The way to break free from the IC mold generally takes a combination of a few things: 1. Interest in growing which you make known to those above you. 2. Available positions (hard to grow into a manager when there is no manager role available or budget to support one) 3. Understanding the difference between "strategy" and "tactics." They mean very different things, and as a manager, depending on the size company, you may be responsible for setting the strategy while your team executes on tactics. 4. A demonstrated willingness and ability to put the company first and protect it. There is a lot of debate on this one and what it means, but generally those who do this get ahead faster than ones who don't, regardless of your viewpoints on whether that is right or not. 5. A growing focus on process and where you team fits in with the rest of the company. By focusing on this, you can find ways to improve team efficiency and performance, and better interface with other departments. As a manager, your job is literally to improve the efficiency and performance of your team and be the glue to other teams.

ryandrake 9y ago

I've found that going from zero to one direct reports is the toughest step (still trying to get there) on the ladder.

JimboOmega 9y ago
I had one for about 6 months, though it didn't do me much good later on.

harryh 9y ago

> I'd be open to tips on how to do it. Some things that can help (in no particular order): - excel in your role as an IC - Take on leadership responsibilities in your role as an IC. Don't just do stuff, own things - Work in a growing organization in constant need of new leadership - Take the initiative to start something new that succeeds to the point that you need additional help to keep it going - Mentor an intern - Ask your manager for leadership responsibilities - Be connected enough to the wider organization that you know when opportunities arise on adjacent teams and leaders of those teams know you well enough to think of you when filling them