20 ms·

It's great that privacy advocates now have such a powerful ally as Apple. Even if it's only just for raising public awareness in that privacy online is importan

It's great that privacy advocates now have such a powerful ally as Apple. Even if it's only just for raising public awareness in that privacy online is important. They are not perfect by any means, but it definitely takes the discussions about privacy, encryption and personal data protection away from the "don't be paranoid" or "just don't be a criminal" territory.

KGIII 9y ago
I still see those sentiments frequently, even posted non-ironically and even on HN. It baffles me. People don't seem to value their rights, especially if they aren't using them. What many don't seem to realize is that the loss of liberties may impact them when they do decide to use them. They may not feel like they need privacy now, but what about what they do becomes taboo? Rights need to protect even the worst among us, and they are eroded by using the worst among us as examples. I don't really have anything to hide from the government, but I damned sure support the 4th. Some day, I might want to hide something and be secure in my person and papers. I don't like most criminal activity and I don't like terrorists, but I really don't want them being used as an excuse to erode my rights.
- KozmoNau7 9y ago
  Exactly, I personally don't feel like I have anything particular to hide, but I fully 100% support people who do feel like they've got something to hide, and their right to privacy. So for now, they can have my data. But I try my very best to avoid letting Google et al. infer other people's actions from mine, so I don't tag people in photos or otherwise expose them or their actions, without their consent.
  - KGIII 9y ago
    We are very similar, in those regards. I don't mind if people post my photos, but I ask that they not tag me in them. I don't have any accounts on what people call social media sites. (I'd argue that Slashdot qualifies as a social media site, for example. I don't have twitter, Facebook, etc...) I have been a sort-of, low-level, public figure. So, I don't mind if people post my picture, I'm used to it. I just ask that they not tag me, specifically in non-public spaces. I only have so much privacy, really. I mean, I've been in newspapers, magazines, and on television and radio. I don't mind if those things get republished, but I'm happily retired and my private life is something I'd like to keep that way. Err... I'm not famous or anything. Well, I'm famous to maybe a dozen people. I had some brief fame when I sold my business, but that was it. I'm not even notable enough for a Wikipedia article, I don't believe. I'm a mathematician who helped bring traffic modeling to the age if computers, that is it. I got lucky and sold my company. It was to a publicly traded company and so there were SEC filings and the likes. That's the extent of my infamy. Since then, I've retired to the side of a mountain in Maine. It's nice and I live here because it's very remote. In return, I get some privacy when I want it. People are good about that here. But, I don't really have anything to hide. I will happily tell you all sorts of information - about me, and only about me. It's not my right to tell you about the private details of other people. So, I don't mind being posted if I am in a public space. I don't mind, within reason, if it is in a private space - but don't tag me and certainly don't tag me in a private space, or tag the people with me. Basically, don't put me in a position where I am used, willingly or not, to compromise the privacy of another person. I don't think that's too much to ask. Just, you know, be smart about it. So, yeah, I can see where you're coming from and very much agree. We're pretty similar in those regards. Also, speech... I don't have anything offensive to say. Yet, I'm a very adamant supporter of the right to free expression. I am even willing to defend the free speech rights of Nazis and Nazis pretty much hate me. I'm not white, not on the political right, and I'm not a huge fan of strict nationalism. Not that they need all those reasons to hate me, they hate me just because of my skin color. But, I still strongly support their rights to free speech. If I can't support their rights, it means I had no principles to begin with. Besides, someday, my speech may be considered harmful. Someone has to defend it. Sorry for the novella. I need to sleep soon.
  - vog 9y ago
    > I fully 100% support people [...] and their right to privacy. [...] So for now, they can have my data. Unfortunately, these are conflicting goals. It is not enough not to tag photos. For example, if you use Gmail, they have your address book, hence they have names and emails of other people. Or, if you publish photos of a group of people, and Google/FB/etc. have working face recognition, they know these people are connected with you (and with each other), and at which time and location you all came together. But imagine they don't even get that from you. If they know private information from yourself, you are training their system to extract that information from others, too. For example, if you are homosexual then you tech them how to recognize homosexuals. If you are heterosexuals, you teach them how to better distinguish homosexuals from heterosexuals. Same for other types of private information. It is impossible to show everything from oneself, and at the same time respect the privacy of vulnerable people nearby oneself.
    - KozmoNau7 9y ago
      By extension, it is utterly impossible to avoid exposing information about yourself, unless you live completely off the grid. I try to have as low an online profile as I can, though.
- newscracker 9y ago
  I care very, very deeply about privacy. I have such conversations with people more often than not. It seems difficult to make people understand the value of privacy and other things we consider as rights. Most of them don't seem to find any problem with government overreach and seem to have enormous trust on the government of the day and all future governments and forces. They also have the same kind of trust on corporations like Facebook and Google. I keep looking for more resources on educating people (and keep some of those around). But we really need to spend a lot of time to make people aware about what they're giving up.

KGIII 9y ago

I still see those sentiments frequently, even posted non-ironically and even on HN. It baffles me. People don't seem to value their rights, especially if they aren't using them. What many don't seem to realize is that the loss of liberties may impact them when they do decide to use them. They may not feel like they need privacy now, but what about what they do becomes taboo? Rights need to protect even the worst among us, and they are eroded by using the worst among us as examples. I don't really have anything to hide from the government, but I damned sure support the 4th. Some day, I might want to hide something and be secure in my person and papers. I don't like most criminal activity and I don't like terrorists, but I really don't want them being used as an excuse to erode my rights.

KozmoNau7 9y ago
Exactly, I personally don't feel like I have anything particular to hide, but I fully 100% support people who do feel like they've got something to hide, and their right to privacy. So for now, they can have my data. But I try my very best to avoid letting Google et al. infer other people's actions from mine, so I don't tag people in photos or otherwise expose them or their actions, without their consent.
- KGIII 9y ago
  We are very similar, in those regards. I don't mind if people post my photos, but I ask that they not tag me in them. I don't have any accounts on what people call social media sites. (I'd argue that Slashdot qualifies as a social media site, for example. I don't have twitter, Facebook, etc...) I have been a sort-of, low-level, public figure. So, I don't mind if people post my picture, I'm used to it. I just ask that they not tag me, specifically in non-public spaces. I only have so much privacy, really. I mean, I've been in newspapers, magazines, and on television and radio. I don't mind if those things get republished, but I'm happily retired and my private life is something I'd like to keep that way. Err... I'm not famous or anything. Well, I'm famous to maybe a dozen people. I had some brief fame when I sold my business, but that was it. I'm not even notable enough for a Wikipedia article, I don't believe. I'm a mathematician who helped bring traffic modeling to the age if computers, that is it. I got lucky and sold my company. It was to a publicly traded company and so there were SEC filings and the likes. That's the extent of my infamy. Since then, I've retired to the side of a mountain in Maine. It's nice and I live here because it's very remote. In return, I get some privacy when I want it. People are good about that here. But, I don't really have anything to hide. I will happily tell you all sorts of information - about me, and only about me. It's not my right to tell you about the private details of other people. So, I don't mind being posted if I am in a public space. I don't mind, within reason, if it is in a private space - but don't tag me and certainly don't tag me in a private space, or tag the people with me. Basically, don't put me in a position where I am used, willingly or not, to compromise the privacy of another person. I don't think that's too much to ask. Just, you know, be smart about it. So, yeah, I can see where you're coming from and very much agree. We're pretty similar in those regards. Also, speech... I don't have anything offensive to say. Yet, I'm a very adamant supporter of the right to free expression. I am even willing to defend the free speech rights of Nazis and Nazis pretty much hate me. I'm not white, not on the political right, and I'm not a huge fan of strict nationalism. Not that they need all those reasons to hate me, they hate me just because of my skin color. But, I still strongly support their rights to free speech. If I can't support their rights, it means I had no principles to begin with. Besides, someday, my speech may be considered harmful. Someone has to defend it. Sorry for the novella. I need to sleep soon.
- vog 9y ago
  > I fully 100% support people [...] and their right to privacy. [...] So for now, they can have my data. Unfortunately, these are conflicting goals. It is not enough not to tag photos. For example, if you use Gmail, they have your address book, hence they have names and emails of other people. Or, if you publish photos of a group of people, and Google/FB/etc. have working face recognition, they know these people are connected with you (and with each other), and at which time and location you all came together. But imagine they don't even get that from you. If they know private information from yourself, you are training their system to extract that information from others, too. For example, if you are homosexual then you tech them how to recognize homosexuals. If you are heterosexuals, you teach them how to better distinguish homosexuals from heterosexuals. Same for other types of private information. It is impossible to show everything from oneself, and at the same time respect the privacy of vulnerable people nearby oneself.
  - KozmoNau7 9y ago
    By extension, it is utterly impossible to avoid exposing information about yourself, unless you live completely off the grid. I try to have as low an online profile as I can, though.
newscracker 9y ago
I care very, very deeply about privacy. I have such conversations with people more often than not. It seems difficult to make people understand the value of privacy and other things we consider as rights. Most of them don't seem to find any problem with government overreach and seem to have enormous trust on the government of the day and all future governments and forces. They also have the same kind of trust on corporations like Facebook and Google. I keep looking for more resources on educating people (and keep some of those around). But we really need to spend a lot of time to make people aware about what they're giving up.