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> A huge advantage of Apply Pay is ... without the hassle of entering a PIN You are forgetting that tools like Apple Pay are not hassle free for most people, e

by knz 9y ago

> A huge advantage of Apply Pay is ... without the hassle of entering a PIN You are forgetting that tools like Apple Pay are not hassle free for most people, especially those outside of IT circles. Millions of people struggle to use anything beyond basic technology (American banks have even decided that PIN's are too confusing! A four digit number that has been common in the rest of the world for decades!). Combine that with other factors like fears of being caught with a flat battery or businesses that are reluctant to spend money on new POS devices - it's unlikely that plastic cards are going away anytime soon. Also, I'm not sure entering a PIN is really any more hassle than using a phone as a payment device (I use Android Pay whenever I can due to the added security features but the POS readers are often incredibly slow).

abalone 9y ago
Not sure what you're talking about. Apple Pay is so much easier and more pleasant to use than chip-and-PIN. It is designed to be easier for the average consumer. And in terms of speed, are we living on the same planet? Chip-and-PIN is notoriously slow in the U.S. Apple Pay takes a second. Also I'm not saying plastic will go away anytime soon. There will be legacy terminals. I'm saying Apply Pay and its ilk are superior to chip-and-PIN, a two decade old technology.
- knz 9y ago
  > are we living on the same planet? Are we? I assume you have never experienced the requests for support from tech illiterate relatives since childhood for assistance with VCR's, PC's, basic cell phones, printers, anything USB related in the 90's, scanners, cable boxes, modems, endless websites/web applications, and of course, smartphones. Demographic changes are shifting the definition of "average consumer" but boomers still dominate and many of them struggle with technology. Chip and PIN is indeed slow in the US (I grew up elsewhere and travel regularly so it drives me insane) but the experience with Android Pay isn't necessarily faster or more convenient. Like I said, I use Android Pay whenever I can but I don't recall ever seeing another person using their smartphone to pay in a store. A quick search seems to suggest this is more than just anecdotal: http://fortune.com/2017/08/04/apple-pay-samsung-mobile-payments/ http://fortune.com/2017/08/04/apple-pay-samsung-mobile-payme... "Despite much publicity upon launch, Apple Pay, Samsung Pay, and Android Pay have struggled to gain traction," the analysts concluded. "Mobile wallet adoption has been underwhelming to date by nearly every objective standard, including initial penetration of smartphone users and repeat usage rate. While up to one-third of U.S. phone owners have enrolled in the payment plans, frequent usage is uncommon, the analysts said. Only 8%, 6%, and 3% of people use Apple Pay, Samsung Pay, and Android Pay at least once per week."
  - BHSPitMonkey 9y ago
    I've switched to Android Pay pretty much everywhere because it's nearly instantaneous, whereas chip transactions require 10-20 seconds of awkward waiting around. Before I had a phone with a fingerprint reader it took more effort to wake and unlock the device, but now that part is frictionless.
    - knz 9y ago
      Android Pay is almost always as slow as chip transactions here in Minnesota. The app seems to work quickly but the POS machine is always slow to complete it's part of the transaction. It seems to vary depending upon the POS machine - for example Trader Joe's is always quick but those in the larger grocery chains or local sandwich shop are painfully slow. From the downvotes I assume it's a regional thing!
  - abalone 9y ago
    Don’t be mislead by the headline. “Up to one-third of U.S. phone owners have enrolled” and a collective 17% of “people” use it regularly. That is not bad! It is still early days; new payment systems take time to roll out. But once you use it you become a fan, as you’ve discovered. And did you just compare enrolling in Apple Pay to a VCR? All you have to do is point your camera at your card. That’s pretty much it. It is very consumer friendly.
- powvans 9y ago
  I 100% agree with you. It's so much better and faster that it's almost confusing. The chip reader POS devices almost all make it seem as though an error has occurred when the transaction succeeds. When the Apple Pay transaction just magically happens I'm left wondering what else I need to do. I would use Apple Pay all the time if more of the places I frequent supported it.
rconti 9y ago
The banks can "decide" all they want, but virtually every American with a bank account already has a PIN for their ATM card.

by knz 9y ago

abalone 9y ago

Not sure what you're talking about. Apple Pay is so much easier and more pleasant to use than chip-and-PIN. It is designed to be easier for the average consumer. And in terms of speed, are we living on the same planet? Chip-and-PIN is notoriously slow in the U.S. Apple Pay takes a second. Also I'm not saying plastic will go away anytime soon. There will be legacy terminals. I'm saying Apply Pay and its ilk are superior to chip-and-PIN, a two decade old technology.

knz 9y ago
> are we living on the same planet? Are we? I assume you have never experienced the requests for support from tech illiterate relatives since childhood for assistance with VCR's, PC's, basic cell phones, printers, anything USB related in the 90's, scanners, cable boxes, modems, endless websites/web applications, and of course, smartphones. Demographic changes are shifting the definition of "average consumer" but boomers still dominate and many of them struggle with technology. Chip and PIN is indeed slow in the US (I grew up elsewhere and travel regularly so it drives me insane) but the experience with Android Pay isn't necessarily faster or more convenient. Like I said, I use Android Pay whenever I can but I don't recall ever seeing another person using their smartphone to pay in a store. A quick search seems to suggest this is more than just anecdotal: http://fortune.com/2017/08/04/apple-pay-samsung-mobile-payments/ http://fortune.com/2017/08/04/apple-pay-samsung-mobile-payme... "Despite much publicity upon launch, Apple Pay, Samsung Pay, and Android Pay have struggled to gain traction," the analysts concluded. "Mobile wallet adoption has been underwhelming to date by nearly every objective standard, including initial penetration of smartphone users and repeat usage rate. While up to one-third of U.S. phone owners have enrolled in the payment plans, frequent usage is uncommon, the analysts said. Only 8%, 6%, and 3% of people use Apple Pay, Samsung Pay, and Android Pay at least once per week."
- BHSPitMonkey 9y ago
  I've switched to Android Pay pretty much everywhere because it's nearly instantaneous, whereas chip transactions require 10-20 seconds of awkward waiting around. Before I had a phone with a fingerprint reader it took more effort to wake and unlock the device, but now that part is frictionless.
  - knz 9y ago
    Android Pay is almost always as slow as chip transactions here in Minnesota. The app seems to work quickly but the POS machine is always slow to complete it's part of the transaction. It seems to vary depending upon the POS machine - for example Trader Joe's is always quick but those in the larger grocery chains or local sandwich shop are painfully slow. From the downvotes I assume it's a regional thing!
- abalone 9y ago
  Don’t be mislead by the headline. “Up to one-third of U.S. phone owners have enrolled” and a collective 17% of “people” use it regularly. That is not bad! It is still early days; new payment systems take time to roll out. But once you use it you become a fan, as you’ve discovered. And did you just compare enrolling in Apple Pay to a VCR? All you have to do is point your camera at your card. That’s pretty much it. It is very consumer friendly.
powvans 9y ago
I 100% agree with you. It's so much better and faster that it's almost confusing. The chip reader POS devices almost all make it seem as though an error has occurred when the transaction succeeds. When the Apple Pay transaction just magically happens I'm left wondering what else I need to do. I would use Apple Pay all the time if more of the places I frequent supported it.

rconti 9y ago

The banks can "decide" all they want, but virtually every American with a bank account already has a PIN for their ATM card.