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"Face ID confirms attention by detecting the direction of your gaze" So to the argument that police can force you to open your iPhone if secured with TouchID,

"Face ID confirms attention by detecting the direction of your gaze" So to the argument that police can force you to open your iPhone if secured with TouchID, is this perhaps more secure? If you refrain from looking at your phone?

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
aeontech 9y ago
No, any kind of biometric auth is vulnerable to the adversary forcing your physical compliance. However you can disable TouchID and FaceID both by pressing the power button five times in quick succession, after which it will require your passcode.
- eridius 9y ago
  For the iPhone X it's hold both the power button and either volume button for 2 seconds.
  - gknoy 9y ago
    I've had a remarkably difficult time getting this kind of thing to register when I try to take screenshots -- probably an issue with my case? -- so it is probably worthwhile to practice doing this ahead of time.
  - Angostura 9y ago
    Actually, I think that’s the hard reset sequence - replacing the Home Power combo
    - eridius 9y ago
      From the PDF: > After initiating power off/Emergency SOS by pressing and holding either volume button and the side button simultaneously for 2 seconds.
- 24gttghh 9y ago
  5-clicks-in-quick-succession primarily activates the "Emergency SOS mode", as well as temporarily disabling TouchID. I think you should edit your post to reflect this.
  - aeontech 9y ago
    It’s disabled until you enter your passcode again, correct, which is what you want. I am not sure what you thought I was saying? If you want to disable it permanently, you can do that in Settings, but doing that requires you to unlock the phone, at which point the adversary may take it and have free reign.
    - 24gttghh 9y ago
      What I'm saying is, if someone wants to simply disable TouchID, without also automatically calling the police by whom they are presently being held then the 5 click method is overkill.
- FilterSweep 9y ago
  > However you can disable TouchID and FaceID both by pressing the power button five times in quick succession This seems effective "on paper, but not in practice." Even if you're innocent, it is one of the most nerve-racking experiences to go through. In the heat of the moment, what if you used an old 5s method to deactivate TouchID instead of whatever method works for the X?
  - aeontech 9y ago
    It works fine for me, but if you have a more practical suggestion, can you expand on that? What do you think would work better?
- SomeHacker44 9y ago
  This is woefully insufficient for a feature I have been begging for forever... I would prefer it to be a double-tap on the power button, or at the very absolute worse, a triple tap. Two buttons simultaneously five times? Impossible to do under any sort of external pressure/duress.
  - mikewhy 9y ago
    Not sure where you got two buttons from. It's only the power button.
    - GeekyBear 9y ago
      On this year's hardware, they have added a new option to temporarily disable biometrics. You press either one of the volume buttons on one side of the phone while also pressing the sleep/wake button on the opposite side. http://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-to-disable-face-id-on-your-iphone-x-just-squeeze-it/ http://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-to-disable-face-id-o...
      - mikewhy 9y ago
        Didn't realise the X model did it differently than all others. Weird.
        GeekyBear 9y ago
        It's also available on the iPhone 8 models. If history is a guide, this will be a new normal that will carry through to future hardware as well.
  - aeontech 9y ago
    Two buttons press and hold on iPhone X. Power button 5x on any other phone.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
scarface74 9y ago
I doubt police will let a little thing like constitutional arguments keep them from forcing you to unlock your phone. The best decryption algorithm is still rubber hose decryption.
FilterSweep 9y ago
> If you refrain from looking at your phone? Unfortunately, (myself included), we are so conditioned to look at your phone when it is out in our face that you would have to actively train against this "reflex".
strictnein 9y ago
Here's what police do today, and it will defeat this and all types of security: Follow you until you make a phone call, or do something that requires you to unlock your phone. Then multiple people descend on you and grab you and your phone.
- empath75 9y ago
  That's if they're interested in looking at your phone for a particular reason, rather than randomly being nosy in a traffic stop.
dmitriid 9y ago
FaceID and TouchID are not passwords, so you have to comply and unlock your phone.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

aeontech 9y ago

No, any kind of biometric auth is vulnerable to the adversary forcing your physical compliance. However you can disable TouchID and FaceID both by pressing the power button five times in quick succession, after which it will require your passcode.

eridius 9y ago
For the iPhone X it's hold both the power button and either volume button for 2 seconds.
- gknoy 9y ago
  I've had a remarkably difficult time getting this kind of thing to register when I try to take screenshots -- probably an issue with my case? -- so it is probably worthwhile to practice doing this ahead of time.
- Angostura 9y ago
  Actually, I think that’s the hard reset sequence - replacing the Home Power combo
  - eridius 9y ago
    From the PDF: > After initiating power off/Emergency SOS by pressing and holding either volume button and the side button simultaneously for 2 seconds.
24gttghh 9y ago
5-clicks-in-quick-succession primarily activates the "Emergency SOS mode", as well as temporarily disabling TouchID. I think you should edit your post to reflect this.
- aeontech 9y ago
  It’s disabled until you enter your passcode again, correct, which is what you want. I am not sure what you thought I was saying? If you want to disable it permanently, you can do that in Settings, but doing that requires you to unlock the phone, at which point the adversary may take it and have free reign.
  - 24gttghh 9y ago
    What I'm saying is, if someone wants to simply disable TouchID, without also automatically calling the police by whom they are presently being held then the 5 click method is overkill.
FilterSweep 9y ago
> However you can disable TouchID and FaceID both by pressing the power button five times in quick succession This seems effective "on paper, but not in practice." Even if you're innocent, it is one of the most nerve-racking experiences to go through. In the heat of the moment, what if you used an old 5s method to deactivate TouchID instead of whatever method works for the X?
- aeontech 9y ago
  It works fine for me, but if you have a more practical suggestion, can you expand on that? What do you think would work better?
SomeHacker44 9y ago
This is woefully insufficient for a feature I have been begging for forever... I would prefer it to be a double-tap on the power button, or at the very absolute worse, a triple tap. Two buttons simultaneously five times? Impossible to do under any sort of external pressure/duress.
- mikewhy 9y ago
  Not sure where you got two buttons from. It's only the power button.
  - GeekyBear 9y ago
    On this year's hardware, they have added a new option to temporarily disable biometrics. You press either one of the volume buttons on one side of the phone while also pressing the sleep/wake button on the opposite side. http://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-to-disable-face-id-on-your-iphone-x-just-squeeze-it/ http://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-to-disable-face-id-o...
    - mikewhy 9y ago
      Didn't realise the X model did it differently than all others. Weird.
      - GeekyBear 9y ago
        It's also available on the iPhone 8 models. If history is a guide, this will be a new normal that will carry through to future hardware as well.
- aeontech 9y ago
  Two buttons press and hold on iPhone X. Power button 5x on any other phone.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

scarface74 9y ago

I doubt police will let a little thing like constitutional arguments keep them from forcing you to unlock your phone. The best decryption algorithm is still rubber hose decryption.

FilterSweep 9y ago

> If you refrain from looking at your phone? Unfortunately, (myself included), we are so conditioned to look at your phone when it is out in our face that you would have to actively train against this "reflex".

strictnein 9y ago

Here's what police do today, and it will defeat this and all types of security: Follow you until you make a phone call, or do something that requires you to unlock your phone. Then multiple people descend on you and grab you and your phone.

empath75 9y ago
That's if they're interested in looking at your phone for a particular reason, rather than randomly being nosy in a traffic stop.

dmitriid 9y ago

FaceID and TouchID are not passwords, so you have to comply and unlock your phone.