5 ms·

Why do you think that minor cryptocurrencies mining operations are worse in regards of wasted fuel than playing computer games, watching mindless YouTube videos

by kbart 9y ago

Why do you think that minor cryptocurrencies mining operations are worse in regards of wasted fuel than playing computer games, watching mindless YouTube videos, scrolling Facebook, leaving devices on when not used, lighting places 24/7 where nobody goes at night anyway etc.? We, as society, waste an enormous amount of resources anyway, I don't see how mining in browser would even dent that. Sure, these mega cryptocurrency mining stations is totally different thing I'm not talking here about.

criddell 9y ago
Mining in a browser is going to consume my battery and bandwidth and you shouldn't be surprised that people aren't happy about that.
- kbart 9y ago
  "Mining in a browser is going to consume my battery and bandwidth" You mean just like ads do? Of course, in a perfect world we wouldn't have either, but I just don't see clear distinction between mining in browser or ads or other useless/annoying things (from the user perspective).
  - detaro 9y ago
    People are unhappy about the kind of ads that do that excessively too.
  - TeMPOraL 9y ago
    In ads, waste of electricity is a bug. The more lean you can make them, the better (even if only because you can then put more of them). In cryptocurrencies, waste is a feature. The more power you burn, the more money you get. One of those disincentivizes waste (howewer weakly). The other incentivizes it.
TeMPOraL 9y ago
Cryptocurrencies in the browser are[0] irrelevant. But they're a part of larger ecosystem of cryptocurrency mining, and that ecosystem is a huge problem. > playing computer games, watching mindless YouTube videos, scrolling Facebook, leaving devices on when not used, lighting places 24/7 where nobody goes at night anyway etc.? We do. But all those examples are the case where energy use gives us something (fun, convenience) and where the waste is bounded (there're only so many devices I can leave powered, and also I have to pay for the power they use). Crypto mining literally pays you for wasting power, so the more electricity you can burn, the more money you get. And the more people join in, the more you have to burn to keep up. So there's almost no ceiling to how much personally you get to waste, and a strong incentive to waste as much as you can. And what's all of that for? To replace a system that works fine and does not have a greed-powered feedback loop of waste? That's just dumb. -- [0] - Currently. Hopefully they'll always stay that way, but there's an off chance this becomes so popular that all new computers will come equipped with additional hardware and drivers to mine crypto for micropayments.
- kbart 9y ago
  "Crypto mining literally pays you for wasting power, so the more electricity you can burn, the more money you get." Well, you (or somebody else) still has to pay for power consumption used for mining, so it just converts money you pay for energy bill to micropayments (though in very unfavorable rate as of yet). Don't get me wrong, I don't advocate such shady behavior in any way, just wanted to point out that this "wasted power" point is a bit of a stretch.
  - TeMPOraL 9y ago
    You pay less for the wasted power than you get in cryptocoins - otherwise you wouldn't mine at all. The delta is what cryptocurrency system pays you for wasting electricity.

by kbart 9y ago

criddell 9y ago

Mining in a browser is going to consume my battery and bandwidth and you shouldn't be surprised that people aren't happy about that.

kbart 9y ago
"Mining in a browser is going to consume my battery and bandwidth" You mean just like ads do? Of course, in a perfect world we wouldn't have either, but I just don't see clear distinction between mining in browser or ads or other useless/annoying things (from the user perspective).
- detaro 9y ago
  People are unhappy about the kind of ads that do that excessively too.
- TeMPOraL 9y ago
  In ads, waste of electricity is a bug. The more lean you can make them, the better (even if only because you can then put more of them). In cryptocurrencies, waste is a feature. The more power you burn, the more money you get. One of those disincentivizes waste (howewer weakly). The other incentivizes it.

TeMPOraL 9y ago

Cryptocurrencies in the browser are[0] irrelevant. But they're a part of larger ecosystem of cryptocurrency mining, and that ecosystem is a huge problem. > playing computer games, watching mindless YouTube videos, scrolling Facebook, leaving devices on when not used, lighting places 24/7 where nobody goes at night anyway etc.? We do. But all those examples are the case where energy use gives us something (fun, convenience) and where the waste is bounded (there're only so many devices I can leave powered, and also I have to pay for the power they use). Crypto mining literally pays you for wasting power, so the more electricity you can burn, the more money you get. And the more people join in, the more you have to burn to keep up. So there's almost no ceiling to how much personally you get to waste, and a strong incentive to waste as much as you can. And what's all of that for? To replace a system that works fine and does not have a greed-powered feedback loop of waste? That's just dumb. -- [0] - Currently. Hopefully they'll always stay that way, but there's an off chance this becomes so popular that all new computers will come equipped with additional hardware and drivers to mine crypto for micropayments.

kbart 9y ago
"Crypto mining literally pays you for wasting power, so the more electricity you can burn, the more money you get." Well, you (or somebody else) still has to pay for power consumption used for mining, so it just converts money you pay for energy bill to micropayments (though in very unfavorable rate as of yet). Don't get me wrong, I don't advocate such shady behavior in any way, just wanted to point out that this "wasted power" point is a bit of a stretch.
- TeMPOraL 9y ago
  You pay less for the wasted power than you get in cryptocoins - otherwise you wouldn't mine at all. The delta is what cryptocurrency system pays you for wasting electricity.