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That's simply factually wrong. The US has much better press freedoms, freedom of speech and gun ownership rights than any other large country. It has nothing t

That's simply factually wrong. The US has much better press freedoms, freedom of speech and gun ownership rights than any other large country. It has nothing to do with an echo chamber. The laws are objectively very different. Comparing surveillance by the NSA to information accessibility in general is disingenuous at best.

the_common_man 9y ago
> The US has much better press freedoms, freedom of speech and gun ownership rights than any other country. Any country that requires and authorizes gun ownership is broken to start with. That you think this is somehow superior and better is.. I don't know what to say. > Comparing surveillance by the NSA to access to information in general is disingenuous at best. What's the difference?
- Danihan 9y ago
  Guns are a constitutional right and a crucial part of self-defense. Not sure what the issue is to you. >What's the difference? One is access, one is privacy. Very different things. Why conflate them.
- electrograv 9y ago
  Please justify your claims here. Most trends to ban weapons in politics are rooted in authoritarian desires disguised in “but think of the children!” emotional rhetoric without logical justification. There is actually a very deep theory behind why gun/weapon ownership is a necessary freedom derived from the fundamental human right of “self ownerhip” (which China would prefer you ignore), which we can dive into here. In short: If you do not have the right to defend a thing, you do not truly own it. If I give you an apple, but say “you’re not allowed to stop me if I try to take it back”, then you do not truly own the apple. Even if I continue to let you have the apple, ultimately I remain the sole owner of the apple (despite any illusions of the contrary) because I have the exclusive power over it. This applies to the self as well; if you do not have the right to effectively defend yourself, you are effectively owned by your government. If only your government has the authority to physical force towards defense of your property and yourself, then it is your government that truly owns you and ‘your’ property. All notions of ownership you may have are illusory, in the absence of such rights to defense. Now in China, at least there is no illusion of freedom. Everyone knows they are owned by the government.
chalupa-man 9y ago
"Than any other large country" is a big stretch. The US is ranked 43rd on this year's Press Freedom Index.
- Danihan 9y ago
  Correct -- and no country with a higher population is higher ranked. Or even close, really.

the_common_man 9y ago

> The US has much better press freedoms, freedom of speech and gun ownership rights than any other country. Any country that requires and authorizes gun ownership is broken to start with. That you think this is somehow superior and better is.. I don't know what to say. > Comparing surveillance by the NSA to access to information in general is disingenuous at best. What's the difference?

Danihan 9y ago
Guns are a constitutional right and a crucial part of self-defense. Not sure what the issue is to you. >What's the difference? One is access, one is privacy. Very different things. Why conflate them.
electrograv 9y ago
Please justify your claims here. Most trends to ban weapons in politics are rooted in authoritarian desires disguised in “but think of the children!” emotional rhetoric without logical justification. There is actually a very deep theory behind why gun/weapon ownership is a necessary freedom derived from the fundamental human right of “self ownerhip” (which China would prefer you ignore), which we can dive into here. In short: If you do not have the right to defend a thing, you do not truly own it. If I give you an apple, but say “you’re not allowed to stop me if I try to take it back”, then you do not truly own the apple. Even if I continue to let you have the apple, ultimately I remain the sole owner of the apple (despite any illusions of the contrary) because I have the exclusive power over it. This applies to the self as well; if you do not have the right to effectively defend yourself, you are effectively owned by your government. If only your government has the authority to physical force towards defense of your property and yourself, then it is your government that truly owns you and ‘your’ property. All notions of ownership you may have are illusory, in the absence of such rights to defense. Now in China, at least there is no illusion of freedom. Everyone knows they are owned by the government.

chalupa-man 9y ago

"Than any other large country" is a big stretch. The US is ranked 43rd on this year's Press Freedom Index.

Danihan 9y ago
Correct -- and no country with a higher population is higher ranked. Or even close, really.