3 ms·

You don't do one thing to fix something like job scarcity, you need a roundup of changes over decades to fix it. You need programs that push people into higher

by jbob2000 9y ago

You don't do one thing to fix something like job scarcity, you need a roundup of changes over decades to fix it. You need programs that push people into higher education so the communities have something to offer. And people can't study at college or university if they have children from unintended pregnancies, so you need to have good social programs to help people from when they enter high school to when they leave grad school. You need healthcare to prevent health issues before they happen and to get people back to work as soon as possible when they do fall ill. You need welfare programs so if shit happens (And it does) you don't have your life completely destroyed and you and your family put on the street. Are any of those policies ones that the Republican party stands for? Sex education, socialized healthcare and education, and welfare are on the GOP hit-list. Democrat states have had these things for decades now, which is why they are the prosperous ones.

Clubber 9y ago
So all those things are great, I don't see how any of them will solve the employment problem plaguing most of the country, either directly or indirectly. The closest thing you listed is pushing people to college degrees. Once they get their degree, they'd have to move to a prosperous city to get employment. The non-prosperous city hasn't improved at all. So I think what you aren't understanding about the problem, is that in all these non-prosperous towns, there are few jobs and most of them pay shit. They had jobs, but they all left. The problem is to get the jobs back. What have the Dems done to get the jobs back? Again, I'm not saying the GOP has done anything either, but see my issue? Nothing is being done by either party, and that's a huge issue affecting millions of families. I mean it's not even really discussed. Warren is the only one even on the trail of some solutions, but she is an outsider (by her own admission). I mean if you go to these areas, it's the Great Depression. The towns are all boarded up and the people are hurting and have been for 4 decades. It's a huge failure of government that this is happening, and has been happening for so long.
- s73ver_ 9y ago
  "What have the Dems done to get the jobs back?" They're not coming back. And if you look, you'll see that Democrats did propose plans in the last election. But without the approval of Congress, there's not much that can be done.
  - Clubber 9y ago
    >They're not coming back. So should we continue to just tell a good chunk of the country to go to hell? What plans would the Dems enact if they sweep the 2020 election? I mean this is the most pressing issue for a huge voting block. Without a good plan, I don't think the Dems can take back the house or senate, much less the presidency. It's long over due, and the GOP don't have any good ideas either. >And if you look, you'll see that Democrats did propose plans in the last election. Like what?
    - s73ver_ 9y ago
      "So should we continue to just tell a good chunk of the country to go to hell? " Absolutely not, and no one is suggesting this. But it would be completely foolhardy to say you're going to "bring back coal" when that's just not going to happen. And please, stop with this "Dems have no plan" narrative. It's entirely false, and it's quite dishonest to bring it up when even a cursory Google search will prove it wrong. https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/workforce-and-skills/ https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/workforce-and-skills/ So Dems do have plans. But the problem is that many of the people in those areas don't want to hear that their previous jobs are gone. They don't want to retrain. So they latch on to the people who say things like, "We're gonna bring back coal jobs," regardless of how realistic it is.
      - Clubber 9y ago
        >But it would be completely foolhardy to say you're going to "bring back coal" when that's just not going to happen. Coal is done (except in China where we send a lot of manufacturing), even the coal workers know that. Subsidizing solar and "solarizing" middle America would create quite a few jobs, including long term jobs maintaining the solar panels, etc. Haven't heard any proposals along those lines though. I believe Obama had mentioned it a few times, but nothing concrete. >stop with this "Dems have no plan" narrative. It's entirely false, and it's quite dishonest to bring it up when even a cursory Google search will prove it wrong. Look, I like the Dems, I vote for them quite a bit, but I'm not going to blindly say they are great and have a real solution to this problem, because they don't, at least none that I've heard anyway. Anyway, I Googled it like you said (I found it odd that no one could actually name any though) and here is Schumer's (and therefore the Democrat's) idea: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/24/opinion/chuck-schumer-employment-democrats.html?mcubz=0&_r=0 https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/24/opinion/chuck-schumer-emp... First, we’re going to increase people’s pay. Second, we’re going to reduce their everyday expenses. And third, we’re going to provide workers with the tools they need for the 21st-century economy. None of these is going to solve the problem. I'll go one at a time. - "First, we’re going to increase people’s pay." Increasing pay is great in the larger cities with a good knowledge and industrial base, but closes a lot of small town stores and restaurants with not a large customer base. Cost of living varies greatly from region to region and even city to city. In summary, this will improve the minimum wage workers positions in already prosperous cities, but hurt them in small towns (which is the target of this discussion). - Lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave. This is nice, but it attacks a symptom rather than the problem of few to no jobs and even fewer ones that pay enough to live on. I assume it's an attempt to lower the cost of living, but I don't see how it does, unless you are sick and already have a job. - We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan. I've always thought this was a good idea, but it's temporary, unless the US commits to building and maintaining a hell of an infrastructure forever. Based on how our elections work and the GOP not liking this sort of thing, I don't see how it could be a permanent solution. I mean it's something though. To solve the middle America problem will require something a lot more radical, I just don't know what it is. I'm hoping to hear it from the Democrats though. I haven't yet. I certainly haven't heard anything from the GOP either.

Clubber 9y ago

So all those things are great, I don't see how any of them will solve the employment problem plaguing most of the country, either directly or indirectly. The closest thing you listed is pushing people to college degrees. Once they get their degree, they'd have to move to a prosperous city to get employment. The non-prosperous city hasn't improved at all. So I think what you aren't understanding about the problem, is that in all these non-prosperous towns, there are few jobs and most of them pay shit. They had jobs, but they all left. The problem is to get the jobs back. What have the Dems done to get the jobs back? Again, I'm not saying the GOP has done anything either, but see my issue? Nothing is being done by either party, and that's a huge issue affecting millions of families. I mean it's not even really discussed. Warren is the only one even on the trail of some solutions, but she is an outsider (by her own admission). I mean if you go to these areas, it's the Great Depression. The towns are all boarded up and the people are hurting and have been for 4 decades. It's a huge failure of government that this is happening, and has been happening for so long.

s73ver_ 9y ago
"What have the Dems done to get the jobs back?" They're not coming back. And if you look, you'll see that Democrats did propose plans in the last election. But without the approval of Congress, there's not much that can be done.
- Clubber 9y ago
  >They're not coming back. So should we continue to just tell a good chunk of the country to go to hell? What plans would the Dems enact if they sweep the 2020 election? I mean this is the most pressing issue for a huge voting block. Without a good plan, I don't think the Dems can take back the house or senate, much less the presidency. It's long over due, and the GOP don't have any good ideas either. >And if you look, you'll see that Democrats did propose plans in the last election. Like what?
  - s73ver_ 9y ago
    "So should we continue to just tell a good chunk of the country to go to hell? " Absolutely not, and no one is suggesting this. But it would be completely foolhardy to say you're going to "bring back coal" when that's just not going to happen. And please, stop with this "Dems have no plan" narrative. It's entirely false, and it's quite dishonest to bring it up when even a cursory Google search will prove it wrong. https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/workforce-and-skills/ https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/workforce-and-skills/ So Dems do have plans. But the problem is that many of the people in those areas don't want to hear that their previous jobs are gone. They don't want to retrain. So they latch on to the people who say things like, "We're gonna bring back coal jobs," regardless of how realistic it is.
    - Clubber 9y ago
      >But it would be completely foolhardy to say you're going to "bring back coal" when that's just not going to happen. Coal is done (except in China where we send a lot of manufacturing), even the coal workers know that. Subsidizing solar and "solarizing" middle America would create quite a few jobs, including long term jobs maintaining the solar panels, etc. Haven't heard any proposals along those lines though. I believe Obama had mentioned it a few times, but nothing concrete. >stop with this "Dems have no plan" narrative. It's entirely false, and it's quite dishonest to bring it up when even a cursory Google search will prove it wrong. Look, I like the Dems, I vote for them quite a bit, but I'm not going to blindly say they are great and have a real solution to this problem, because they don't, at least none that I've heard anyway. Anyway, I Googled it like you said (I found it odd that no one could actually name any though) and here is Schumer's (and therefore the Democrat's) idea: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/24/opinion/chuck-schumer-employment-democrats.html?mcubz=0&_r=0 https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/24/opinion/chuck-schumer-emp... First, we’re going to increase people’s pay. Second, we’re going to reduce their everyday expenses. And third, we’re going to provide workers with the tools they need for the 21st-century economy. None of these is going to solve the problem. I'll go one at a time. - "First, we’re going to increase people’s pay." Increasing pay is great in the larger cities with a good knowledge and industrial base, but closes a lot of small town stores and restaurants with not a large customer base. Cost of living varies greatly from region to region and even city to city. In summary, this will improve the minimum wage workers positions in already prosperous cities, but hurt them in small towns (which is the target of this discussion). - Lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave. This is nice, but it attacks a symptom rather than the problem of few to no jobs and even fewer ones that pay enough to live on. I assume it's an attempt to lower the cost of living, but I don't see how it does, unless you are sick and already have a job. - We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan. I've always thought this was a good idea, but it's temporary, unless the US commits to building and maintaining a hell of an infrastructure forever. Based on how our elections work and the GOP not liking this sort of thing, I don't see how it could be a permanent solution. I mean it's something though. To solve the middle America problem will require something a lot more radical, I just don't know what it is. I'm hoping to hear it from the Democrats though. I haven't yet. I certainly haven't heard anything from the GOP either.