4 ms·

No kidding. I'm at the point of almost exclusively developing webapps. Universal, instant, and powerful. It's the perfect platform.

goatlover 9y ago
It's really not. HTML and CSS are far from ideal for making applications. JS has gotten better, but it still lacking in some ways. And there is no IDE for the web, whereas Smalltalk had one in the 70s, and numerous ones have existed for other platforms since then.
- artursapek 9y ago
  You have to wonder why it is, then, that the web has gotten so big and all of those other "platforms" are marked with tombstones.
  - goatlover 9y ago
    Obviously for other reasons, like the fact that everyone has a browser for free on their device, and everyone knows how to use Google. There are very strong network effects in favor of the web. It is a great platform in some ways. But it's not ideal for creating applications.
- kowdermeister 9y ago
  Try VSCode it's one of the best IDE, it has code completion, built in documentation and even code autocomplete for JavaScript. https://imgur.com/a/26oFa https://imgur.com/a/26oFa
  - goatlover 9y ago
    It's an IDE for a programming language, which is only part of the picture. Compare it to what the Flash IDE or Visual Basic offered developers. Or Smalltalk in terms of a fully customizable, live environment. Maybe something that's a cross between Developer Tools, Flash Designer and the Smalltalk environment. Anyway, VS Code isn't the development environment for the web. It's just one of many options for writing Javascript.
    - kowdermeister 9y ago
      What would a dream tool for web development would look like to you? Edit: VSCode is not for one language, it supports dozens and dozens of technologies... wait for it... for the web.
      - goatlover 9y ago
        Yeah, I've tried it. I've also used Adobe tools and Visual Basic before, and some web layout/theme builders. So it's the IDE plus the visual building environment, with tools for animation and what not. I also use Jupyter Notebooks, and having a rich REPL is great for prototyping and exploration. So maybe something like the Smalltalk environment, where the environment is a fully customizeable web browser, and the language is your choice, which would get compiled to WASM or JS.
        goatlover 9y ago
        To clarify, it's the IDE plus the live environment plus the layout and design tools.
- SquareWheel 9y ago
  IntelliJ has multiple IDEs for web development, or programming text editors like VS Code and Sublime. Even Chrome allows for a very fluid editing and debugging experience. Half the time I write my code directly in the browser.
  - goatlover 9y ago
    I had in mind IDE with visual layout in a live environment such as Chrome's dev tools.
    - SquareWheel 9y ago
      The live environment is the page. You can tweak any CSS value and have it update live, or save to a file. You can run breakpoints to examine code execution, examine call stacks and use the console for input and output. It's really no different from developing in IntelliJ or similar. The only difference is you don't need to hit "compile" first.

goatlover 9y ago

It's really not. HTML and CSS are far from ideal for making applications. JS has gotten better, but it still lacking in some ways. And there is no IDE for the web, whereas Smalltalk had one in the 70s, and numerous ones have existed for other platforms since then.

artursapek 9y ago
You have to wonder why it is, then, that the web has gotten so big and all of those other "platforms" are marked with tombstones.
- goatlover 9y ago
  Obviously for other reasons, like the fact that everyone has a browser for free on their device, and everyone knows how to use Google. There are very strong network effects in favor of the web. It is a great platform in some ways. But it's not ideal for creating applications.
kowdermeister 9y ago
Try VSCode it's one of the best IDE, it has code completion, built in documentation and even code autocomplete for JavaScript. https://imgur.com/a/26oFa https://imgur.com/a/26oFa
- goatlover 9y ago
  It's an IDE for a programming language, which is only part of the picture. Compare it to what the Flash IDE or Visual Basic offered developers. Or Smalltalk in terms of a fully customizable, live environment. Maybe something that's a cross between Developer Tools, Flash Designer and the Smalltalk environment. Anyway, VS Code isn't the development environment for the web. It's just one of many options for writing Javascript.
  - kowdermeister 9y ago
    What would a dream tool for web development would look like to you? Edit: VSCode is not for one language, it supports dozens and dozens of technologies... wait for it... for the web.
    - goatlover 9y ago
      Yeah, I've tried it. I've also used Adobe tools and Visual Basic before, and some web layout/theme builders. So it's the IDE plus the visual building environment, with tools for animation and what not. I also use Jupyter Notebooks, and having a rich REPL is great for prototyping and exploration. So maybe something like the Smalltalk environment, where the environment is a fully customizeable web browser, and the language is your choice, which would get compiled to WASM or JS.
      - goatlover 9y ago
        To clarify, it's the IDE plus the live environment plus the layout and design tools.
SquareWheel 9y ago
IntelliJ has multiple IDEs for web development, or programming text editors like VS Code and Sublime. Even Chrome allows for a very fluid editing and debugging experience. Half the time I write my code directly in the browser.
- goatlover 9y ago
  I had in mind IDE with visual layout in a live environment such as Chrome's dev tools.
  - SquareWheel 9y ago
    The live environment is the page. You can tweak any CSS value and have it update live, or save to a file. You can run breakpoints to examine code execution, examine call stacks and use the console for input and output. It's really no different from developing in IntelliJ or similar. The only difference is you don't need to hit "compile" first.