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Also, the didn't government didn't ruled the referendum illegal a constitutional COURT did it. And the detentions and search were ordered by a JUDGE from Barcel

Also, the didn't government didn't ruled the referendum illegal a constitutional COURT did it. And the detentions and search were ordered by a JUDGE from Barcelona that not long ago was awarded by the same Catalan government that now is criticizing him. Please read this to know the facts: https://elpais.com/elpais/2017/09/20/inenglish/1505917320_788824.html https://elpais.com/elpais/2017/09/20/inenglish/1505917320_78...

toast0 9y ago
A court is an arm of the Kingdom of Spain, and a judge is a Kingdom employee. In US parlance, where the EFF is based, we would say the court is an arm of the government, and the judge is a government employee, thus this is a government action. In European parlance, 'the government' often means the currently in-power group of legislative representatives, which causes much confusion in the US when we hear 'a new government was formed in X', or 'the government will be dissolved in Y'.
- faragon 9y ago
  Spanish King has no actual power, we have a democratic monarchy.
  - tbatchelli 9y ago
    Monarchies are not democratic. Unless I can vote the King, that is.
    - skwirl 9y ago
      What if your elected representatives can vote to abolish the royalty?
      - tbatchelli 9y ago
        Good point. I believe you could.
    - ihaveajob 9y ago
      Is the UK a democracy?
tbatchelli 9y ago
The referendum hasn't been ruled illegal. The constitutional court grants an automatic stay on any law at the Spanish central government request. Automatic. They haven't made a judgement. And by the way, this is a political problem that the Spanish government refuses to tackle politically, making it a criminal issue. Is it criminal to want to not belong to a country that thinks that promoting a referendum is a crime? Also, El Pais is certainly not partisan, no...
sigotirandolas 9y ago
I think that the Spanish Constitutional Court can be hardly considered independent of the Spanish government (most of its members have been historically appointed by the PP and the PSOE, the main Spanish parties, see [1]), so I don't think EFF's point here is invalid, even if clarifications are possible. Without knowing the specifics I'm inclined to think the decision by Barcelona's judge would be just a consequence of the Constitutional's Court ruling. [1]: http://www.elmundo.es/espana/2015/08/20/55d4cbb646163f3c1c8b457b.html http://www.elmundo.es/espana/2015/08/20/55d4cbb646163f3c1c8b...: The Spanish Constitutional Court has 12 members, of which 4 are chosen by the congress, 4 are chosen by the senate, 2 are chosen by the governing party, and 2 by the "Consejo General del Poder Judicial".

toast0 9y ago

A court is an arm of the Kingdom of Spain, and a judge is a Kingdom employee. In US parlance, where the EFF is based, we would say the court is an arm of the government, and the judge is a government employee, thus this is a government action. In European parlance, 'the government' often means the currently in-power group of legislative representatives, which causes much confusion in the US when we hear 'a new government was formed in X', or 'the government will be dissolved in Y'.

faragon 9y ago
Spanish King has no actual power, we have a democratic monarchy.
- tbatchelli 9y ago
  Monarchies are not democratic. Unless I can vote the King, that is.
  - skwirl 9y ago
    What if your elected representatives can vote to abolish the royalty?
    - tbatchelli 9y ago
      Good point. I believe you could.
  - ihaveajob 9y ago
    Is the UK a democracy?

tbatchelli 9y ago

The referendum hasn't been ruled illegal. The constitutional court grants an automatic stay on any law at the Spanish central government request. Automatic. They haven't made a judgement. And by the way, this is a political problem that the Spanish government refuses to tackle politically, making it a criminal issue. Is it criminal to want to not belong to a country that thinks that promoting a referendum is a crime? Also, El Pais is certainly not partisan, no...

sigotirandolas 9y ago

I think that the Spanish Constitutional Court can be hardly considered independent of the Spanish government (most of its members have been historically appointed by the PP and the PSOE, the main Spanish parties, see [1]), so I don't think EFF's point here is invalid, even if clarifications are possible. Without knowing the specifics I'm inclined to think the decision by Barcelona's judge would be just a consequence of the Constitutional's Court ruling. [1]: http://www.elmundo.es/espana/2015/08/20/55d4cbb646163f3c1c8b457b.html http://www.elmundo.es/espana/2015/08/20/55d4cbb646163f3c1c8b...: The Spanish Constitutional Court has 12 members, of which 4 are chosen by the congress, 4 are chosen by the senate, 2 are chosen by the governing party, and 2 by the "Consejo General del Poder Judicial".