4 ms·

So this is like an acqui-hire except that the employees don't see any benefit from it except that they are now Google employees? Meanwhile, HTC Executives pock

So this is like an acqui-hire except that the employees don't see any benefit from it except that they are now Google employees? Meanwhile, HTC Executives pocket a huge wad of cash? Great.

s73ver_ 9y ago
Isn't that any acqui-hire? The people who do the work are traded like cattle and usually don't get anything out of it. Worse, sometimes they did have equity in the company, but that's now traded for equity in the new company, but with a reset on the vesting time period.
- scottlegrand2 9y ago
  Not if you just say no to startup equity offers for less than 1% of the company, but sadly there's one born every millisecond...
  - s73ver_ 9y ago
    Very few people have that kind of bargaining power. Calling someone who doesn't a "sucker" is just being an ass.
    - scottlegrand2 9y ago
      Disagree. We all have choices. But it's easy to convince yourself otherwise. If you're getting less than 1%, you'll get a better ROI working for the bigCo of your choosing. Suggesting otherwise is disingenuous. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4008733 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4008733
      - s73ver_ 9y ago
        Your statement does nothing to advance your point; rather, all it does is show you have no empathy for others.
        scottlegrand2 9y ago
        I am confused. What point do you think I am trying to make? I thought my point was that startups are usually a bad risk for less than 1% of the equity pie when compared to the other major option of working for an established tech company with a stable income and work/life balance. Are you saying some people have no other choice in life except to take a craptastic gig at a horrible startup for 0.1% or less of the equity? And by disagreeing, I am somehow some sort of sociopath?
        dang 9y ago
        Ai yai yai. Please please don't go back to commenting in this spirit. We ban accounts—we have to ban accounts—that do this. (I left yours unpenalized the last time we had an exchange like this, because it seemed you were commenting in good faith, and I still think that.) All: we recently updated https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html, so now would be a good time for a refresher.
        s73ver_ 9y ago
        I am sorry. But I do also feel that refusing to believe that not everyone has that level of bargaining power is also quite uncivil.
        scottlegrand2 9y ago
        So what you're saying is that some people accept poor startup offers because they want to work for a startup so badly that the opportunity to do so outweighs the bad risk they are taking? How is that anyone's fault except their own? In my opinion that kind of person is in serious need of a moment of clarity. And refusing to acknowledge that there are people in the world that see things differently is quite uncivil IMO. When I was younger, I took several craptastic startup offers because of the allure of working for a startup. Not one of them panned out. But I also turned down offers from Autodesk and Nvidia at a time when accepting would have made me worth 50 to 100 million dollars today. Feeling loyal to those craptastic startups and also feeling somewhat that I had no other options were part of why I made those bad calls. Don't be former me.
    - flukus 9y ago
      Very few individuals. I'm sure if these people formed some kind of group and bargained as a collective they could threaten to walk out if they didn't get any benefit. But that's considered crazy talk in our industry.
      - scottlegrand2 9y ago
        If Google is interested in acquiring the engineering talent of these at will employees, that seems like a strong signal that they're worth a lot more than they think, no? At the very least, they should negotiate directly with Google to sweeten their deal, preferably with at least one counteroffer for their talent. On the other hand, if Google is making a better offer than all other comers, then they should just take it. If you don't at least attempt to negotiate, I can almost guarantee you're leaving something on the table.
jumpbug 9y ago
Perhaps the business unit wasn't doing well and the alternative may have been lost jobs?
geodel 9y ago
Good. You discovered a bit on how businesses work. In this case it ended little beneficial to many employees as instead of being laid off due to HTC downsizing or shutdown, they get to work for Google.
- scottlegrand2 9y ago
  You say that like there's a surfeit of talent in tech. That's not the case in my experience. I do think there is an oversupply of fungibles though and companies seem to be adapting to that.

So this is like an acqui-hire except that the employees don't see any benefit from it except that they are now Google employees? Meanwhile, HTC Executives pocket a huge wad of cash? Great.

s73ver_ 9y ago

Isn't that any acqui-hire? The people who do the work are traded like cattle and usually don't get anything out of it. Worse, sometimes they did have equity in the company, but that's now traded for equity in the new company, but with a reset on the vesting time period.

scottlegrand2 9y ago
Not if you just say no to startup equity offers for less than 1% of the company, but sadly there's one born every millisecond...
- s73ver_ 9y ago
  Very few people have that kind of bargaining power. Calling someone who doesn't a "sucker" is just being an ass.
  - scottlegrand2 9y ago
    Disagree. We all have choices. But it's easy to convince yourself otherwise. If you're getting less than 1%, you'll get a better ROI working for the bigCo of your choosing. Suggesting otherwise is disingenuous. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4008733 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4008733
    - s73ver_ 9y ago
      Your statement does nothing to advance your point; rather, all it does is show you have no empathy for others.
      - scottlegrand2 9y ago
        I am confused. What point do you think I am trying to make? I thought my point was that startups are usually a bad risk for less than 1% of the equity pie when compared to the other major option of working for an established tech company with a stable income and work/life balance. Are you saying some people have no other choice in life except to take a craptastic gig at a horrible startup for 0.1% or less of the equity? And by disagreeing, I am somehow some sort of sociopath?
      - dang 9y ago
        Ai yai yai. Please please don't go back to commenting in this spirit. We ban accounts—we have to ban accounts—that do this. (I left yours unpenalized the last time we had an exchange like this, because it seemed you were commenting in good faith, and I still think that.) All: we recently updated https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html, so now would be a good time for a refresher.
        s73ver_ 9y ago
        I am sorry. But I do also feel that refusing to believe that not everyone has that level of bargaining power is also quite uncivil.
        scottlegrand2 9y ago
        So what you're saying is that some people accept poor startup offers because they want to work for a startup so badly that the opportunity to do so outweighs the bad risk they are taking? How is that anyone's fault except their own? In my opinion that kind of person is in serious need of a moment of clarity. And refusing to acknowledge that there are people in the world that see things differently is quite uncivil IMO. When I was younger, I took several craptastic startup offers because of the allure of working for a startup. Not one of them panned out. But I also turned down offers from Autodesk and Nvidia at a time when accepting would have made me worth 50 to 100 million dollars today. Feeling loyal to those craptastic startups and also feeling somewhat that I had no other options were part of why I made those bad calls. Don't be former me.
  - flukus 9y ago
    Very few individuals. I'm sure if these people formed some kind of group and bargained as a collective they could threaten to walk out if they didn't get any benefit. But that's considered crazy talk in our industry.
    - scottlegrand2 9y ago
      If Google is interested in acquiring the engineering talent of these at will employees, that seems like a strong signal that they're worth a lot more than they think, no? At the very least, they should negotiate directly with Google to sweeten their deal, preferably with at least one counteroffer for their talent. On the other hand, if Google is making a better offer than all other comers, then they should just take it. If you don't at least attempt to negotiate, I can almost guarantee you're leaving something on the table.

jumpbug 9y ago

Perhaps the business unit wasn't doing well and the alternative may have been lost jobs?

geodel 9y ago

Good. You discovered a bit on how businesses work. In this case it ended little beneficial to many employees as instead of being laid off due to HTC downsizing or shutdown, they get to work for Google.

scottlegrand2 9y ago
You say that like there's a surfeit of talent in tech. That's not the case in my experience. I do think there is an oversupply of fungibles though and companies seem to be adapting to that.