6 ms·

My son got a letter insisting he owed money on his college loan. He never had a loan. I paid for his education without any loans. He asked for documentation and

by KGIII 9y ago

My son got a letter insisting he owed money on his college loan. He never had a loan. I paid for his education without any loans. He asked for documentation and they stalled. I finally had my lawyer write a letter on his behalf and, sure enough, they had made an error and were deeply sorry for our inconvenience. Notably, they didn't offer to cover my time, his time, and the expense of the lawyer. I value my time more than I value money. I consider these things theft of my time.

javajosh 9y ago
Did you consider taking them to small claims court to recover your costs?
- johnvonneumann 9y ago
  This, I don't consider myself a vindictive person, but financial vultures need to be punished.
- KGIII 9y ago
  Not really. The thought crossed my mind but I figured it'd just be more of my time being spent. I can make more money. My time is a finite commodity. I'd rather waste it on fun things.
  - joering2 9y ago
    Didnt you think for a minute of your precious time that you had perfect opportunity to teach them a lesson and burn some of their money in the process? These scumbags dont exist because we dont have laws strictly prohibiting what they doing - they exist because only very tiny fraction of people they tried defraud will do something about it.
    - KGIII 9y ago
      Nope.
- 35bge57dtjku 9y ago
  I doubt that would go over well. He could have simply stuck to asking for proof before paying and that might have been the end of it.
  - adrianratnapala 9y ago
    I doubt it. The nature of debt collection, and many other legal pickles is that if you are seen to be passively ignoring it, then it just ramps up. Merely asking for proof is indistinguishable from ignoring claims because it leaves no paper trail. You have to actually get documents from them (or from a court) saying that they have no claim. And it costs a lot (whether in time, money or both) to get that.
    - chopin 9y ago
      In Germany it would have been sufficient to ask for proof in writing with a return receipt. There's your paper trail. If they insist after that, threaten criminal charges. This worked wonders for me in the past. Additionally, loser pays (unfortunately, not for my time, though). This would never go to court. But you can't ignore it, that's true.
    - manarth 9y ago
      > You have to actually get documents from them > (or from a court) saying that they have no claim. Naturally this varies in different jurisdictions, but generally speaking, the burden of proof is on the person making the claim. If I say that you owe me money, it's not necessary for you to obtain documents (from either me or from a court) stating that you don't owe me money - the onus is on me to _prove_ that you me money.
      - colejohnson66 9y ago
        Why would the burden of proof be on the person in debt? How do you prove a negative?
        manarth 9y ago
tryingagainbro 9y ago
Had he been sued and not been there at trial time, he'd be screwed. Judges shouldn't just dismiss the cases, they should professionally sanction the lawyers for knowingly filing fraudulent lawsuits, and fine the companies something like 3X the amount sued for. Even if I owe money...why should I pay you? Prove you bought the loans, tomorrow someone else can ask me to pay for it again.
- greenyoda 9y ago
  "Even if I owe money... why should I pay you? Prove you bought the loans, tomorrow someone else can ask me to pay for it again." That's an excellent point. The fact that you paid off a fraudster doesn't in any way change the fact that you still owe money to the legitimate owner of the loan. So you need to demand proof that whoever is asking you for payment is the owner of the loan and not a fraudster.

by KGIII 9y ago

javajosh 9y ago

Did you consider taking them to small claims court to recover your costs?

johnvonneumann 9y ago
This, I don't consider myself a vindictive person, but financial vultures need to be punished.
KGIII 9y ago
Not really. The thought crossed my mind but I figured it'd just be more of my time being spent. I can make more money. My time is a finite commodity. I'd rather waste it on fun things.
- joering2 9y ago
  Didnt you think for a minute of your precious time that you had perfect opportunity to teach them a lesson and burn some of their money in the process? These scumbags dont exist because we dont have laws strictly prohibiting what they doing - they exist because only very tiny fraction of people they tried defraud will do something about it.
  - KGIII 9y ago
    Nope.
35bge57dtjku 9y ago
I doubt that would go over well. He could have simply stuck to asking for proof before paying and that might have been the end of it.
- adrianratnapala 9y ago
  I doubt it. The nature of debt collection, and many other legal pickles is that if you are seen to be passively ignoring it, then it just ramps up. Merely asking for proof is indistinguishable from ignoring claims because it leaves no paper trail. You have to actually get documents from them (or from a court) saying that they have no claim. And it costs a lot (whether in time, money or both) to get that.
  - chopin 9y ago
    In Germany it would have been sufficient to ask for proof in writing with a return receipt. There's your paper trail. If they insist after that, threaten criminal charges. This worked wonders for me in the past. Additionally, loser pays (unfortunately, not for my time, though). This would never go to court. But you can't ignore it, that's true.
  - manarth 9y ago
    > You have to actually get documents from them > (or from a court) saying that they have no claim. Naturally this varies in different jurisdictions, but generally speaking, the burden of proof is on the person making the claim. If I say that you owe me money, it's not necessary for you to obtain documents (from either me or from a court) stating that you don't owe me money - the onus is on me to _prove_ that you me money.
    - colejohnson66 9y ago
      Why would the burden of proof be on the person in debt? How do you prove a negative?
      - manarth 9y ago

tryingagainbro 9y ago

Had he been sued and not been there at trial time, he'd be screwed. Judges shouldn't just dismiss the cases, they should professionally sanction the lawyers for knowingly filing fraudulent lawsuits, and fine the companies something like 3X the amount sued for. Even if I owe money...why should I pay you? Prove you bought the loans, tomorrow someone else can ask me to pay for it again.

greenyoda 9y ago
"Even if I owe money... why should I pay you? Prove you bought the loans, tomorrow someone else can ask me to pay for it again." That's an excellent point. The fact that you paid off a fraudster doesn't in any way change the fact that you still owe money to the legitimate owner of the loan. So you need to demand proof that whoever is asking you for payment is the owner of the loan and not a fraudster.