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>You cannot see, or feel, the pain he experienced when many of his friends and colleagues deserted him or when he was forcibly separated from his cancer-fightin

>You cannot see, or feel, the pain he experienced when many of his friends and colleagues deserted him or when he was forcibly separated from his cancer-fighting foundation. Literal LOL on this - Oh poor Lance... I forgot the part of the story where his friends deserted him, and not the other way around. If you want a real glimpse into all the people he screwed over, check out the documentary 'Stop at Nothing' https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16ofoGHNTXs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16ofoGHNTXs In all honesty, as a cyclist, and a fan of professional cycling, I'd be able to forgive the cheating, everyone was doing it during that era. But the way he handled everything else was a complete disgrace.

esterly 9y ago
Agreed. As a former fan I can say I was duped. DDG/Google Lance Armstrong D... and it will autocomplete to Destroys lives. http://www.espn.com/sports/endurance/story/_/id/8860572/former-employee-says-lance-armstrong-made-life-very-very-unpleasant http://www.espn.com/sports/endurance/story/_/id/8860572/form... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/lancearmstrong/9804679/Armstrong-team-mate-Lance-ruined-peoples-lives-if-they-accused-him-of-doping.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/lancear... http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gil-laroya/understanding-how-bad-lan_b_2513561.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gil-laroya/understanding-how-b...
eksemplar 9y ago
As a European I never understood why Armstrong had it so rough, almost every top tour contestant from the era and going back almost 50 years have been doped, many of them have even admitted it. Yet Armstrong got completely fucked by it. I used to think it was because America handles liars and cheats different than us, but looking at your bankers and wallstreeters go free as well as Trump winning and remaining in the White House, it seems that you're not rougher on liars and cheats than we are. So what was it? Was Armstrong really that much of an asshole?
- Overtonwindow 9y ago
  America has a very vengeful streak. We don't just get angry when we disagree, we take vengeance and retribution to an entirely new level.
- SOLAR_FIELDS 9y ago
  If we are trying to draw comparison between Armstrong and political wrongdoing, it seems somewhat straightforward: in the case of Armstrong, it's much more black and white than in the case of bankers and politicians. He admitted wrongdoing and put himself on the cross for the nation. Contrasted with the case of bankers and politicians, who dwell in the eternal grey area, never once owning up to their misdeeds, the comparative black-and-white of Armstrong's admittance makes it much easier to have a simple and straightforward moral enmity. Humanity likes to deal in black and white situations, and Armstrong's is much more black and white than anyone else. If he had not admitted his wrongs the vitriol would not be as strong and the impact would not have been as large. As much of an asshole as Armstrong is purported to be, because he actually stood up and spoke out, he deserves so much more respect than those who have done so much worse and fade into the grey wall of evil in obscurity. If we are to consider our society to be based on some sort of ethics, it is clearly a wrong that has been accomplished on Armstrong's part and he definitely deserved at least a good portion of what happened to him. But to see a man who really did not much more than make a fool out of a beloved sport crucified more than those who have actually contributed to the financial ruin of millions of Americans by facilitating the financial crisis, for instance, is nothing short of depressing. And do not interpret my comment the wrong way: I feel no sympathy for Armstrong. The absolute worst case scenario for him touched on in the article is that he loses the lawsuit and has to pay away everything but keeps his apparently untouchable 8 million dollar home in Austin, which he might be forced to sell and then live a comfortably upper middle class lifestyle that would still be better than most of the better off earners here on HN.
- kamaal 9y ago
  Armstrong had become some thing more than a successful athlete. He is an inspiration for anybody who has suffered and lost everything in life and has come back and done great things in life. He is a cancer survivor, who also won the most grueling athletic competitions of the modern times. He must have cheated. But I see it nothing more than those succeed due to things like affirmative action. And he is hated for exactly the same reasons. Other capable people do not see why he must be excused or they be made to swallow up a loss, for a problem that is not theirs.
sgpl 9y ago
" . . . and then Lance Armstrong reached me. He grabbed my by the shoulder, because he knew that everyone would be watching, and he knew that at that moment, he could show everyone that he was the boss. He stopped me, and he said what I was saying wasn't true, what I was saying was bad for cycling, that I musn't say it, that I had no right to be a professional cyclist, that I should quit cycling, that I should quit the tour, and finished by saying [beep] you. . . . I was depressed for 6 months. I was crying all of the time. I was in a really bad way." - Bassons, from BBC Radio 5, 2012 10 15[9] Reading about Armstrong lead me to the wikipedia page for Christophe Bassons [1], a professional cyclist that called out Armstrong (and drug use in the profession). It is enraging to read that Bassons had to end his career early as a result of taking a stance against rampant cheating. What's particularly infuriating is that he likely got robbed of the opportunity to (perhaps) win a few titles, due to the unfair competition. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christophe_Bassons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christophe_Bassons
- pasbesoin 9y ago
  One of many aspects/details that have caused me to turn my back on professional sports -- formally declared or otherwise (college football, the Olympics, etc.). It would be inspiring if we could have professional sports-persons who could make a decent living extolling the virtues of sport and leading by example. "Decent" living -- not obscene incomes based upon monopolies and taxpayer extortion (stadium costs, tax exemptions, etc.) feeding yet greater ownership incomes (another form of rent-seeking, in its way). But instead, cash is king. And the virtues of sport get turned into vices -- whether practiced by the players, or upon them (e.g. football's heavy toll). I don't like this corruption. So I vote with my feet -- that is to say, with my dollars. Anyway, sport is meant for actual participation. Any professional level should build upon that. Not upon eyeballs and asses in seats (doing nothing).

esterly 9y ago

Agreed. As a former fan I can say I was duped. DDG/Google Lance Armstrong D... and it will autocomplete to Destroys lives. http://www.espn.com/sports/endurance/story/_/id/8860572/former-employee-says-lance-armstrong-made-life-very-very-unpleasant http://www.espn.com/sports/endurance/story/_/id/8860572/form... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/lancearmstrong/9804679/Armstrong-team-mate-Lance-ruined-peoples-lives-if-they-accused-him-of-doping.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/lancear... http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gil-laroya/understanding-how-bad-lan_b_2513561.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gil-laroya/understanding-how-b...

eksemplar 9y ago

As a European I never understood why Armstrong had it so rough, almost every top tour contestant from the era and going back almost 50 years have been doped, many of them have even admitted it. Yet Armstrong got completely fucked by it. I used to think it was because America handles liars and cheats different than us, but looking at your bankers and wallstreeters go free as well as Trump winning and remaining in the White House, it seems that you're not rougher on liars and cheats than we are. So what was it? Was Armstrong really that much of an asshole?

Overtonwindow 9y ago
America has a very vengeful streak. We don't just get angry when we disagree, we take vengeance and retribution to an entirely new level.
SOLAR_FIELDS 9y ago
If we are trying to draw comparison between Armstrong and political wrongdoing, it seems somewhat straightforward: in the case of Armstrong, it's much more black and white than in the case of bankers and politicians. He admitted wrongdoing and put himself on the cross for the nation. Contrasted with the case of bankers and politicians, who dwell in the eternal grey area, never once owning up to their misdeeds, the comparative black-and-white of Armstrong's admittance makes it much easier to have a simple and straightforward moral enmity. Humanity likes to deal in black and white situations, and Armstrong's is much more black and white than anyone else. If he had not admitted his wrongs the vitriol would not be as strong and the impact would not have been as large. As much of an asshole as Armstrong is purported to be, because he actually stood up and spoke out, he deserves so much more respect than those who have done so much worse and fade into the grey wall of evil in obscurity. If we are to consider our society to be based on some sort of ethics, it is clearly a wrong that has been accomplished on Armstrong's part and he definitely deserved at least a good portion of what happened to him. But to see a man who really did not much more than make a fool out of a beloved sport crucified more than those who have actually contributed to the financial ruin of millions of Americans by facilitating the financial crisis, for instance, is nothing short of depressing. And do not interpret my comment the wrong way: I feel no sympathy for Armstrong. The absolute worst case scenario for him touched on in the article is that he loses the lawsuit and has to pay away everything but keeps his apparently untouchable 8 million dollar home in Austin, which he might be forced to sell and then live a comfortably upper middle class lifestyle that would still be better than most of the better off earners here on HN.
kamaal 9y ago
Armstrong had become some thing more than a successful athlete. He is an inspiration for anybody who has suffered and lost everything in life and has come back and done great things in life. He is a cancer survivor, who also won the most grueling athletic competitions of the modern times. He must have cheated. But I see it nothing more than those succeed due to things like affirmative action. And he is hated for exactly the same reasons. Other capable people do not see why he must be excused or they be made to swallow up a loss, for a problem that is not theirs.

sgpl 9y ago

" . . . and then Lance Armstrong reached me. He grabbed my by the shoulder, because he knew that everyone would be watching, and he knew that at that moment, he could show everyone that he was the boss. He stopped me, and he said what I was saying wasn't true, what I was saying was bad for cycling, that I musn't say it, that I had no right to be a professional cyclist, that I should quit cycling, that I should quit the tour, and finished by saying [beep] you. . . . I was depressed for 6 months. I was crying all of the time. I was in a really bad way." - Bassons, from BBC Radio 5, 2012 10 15[9] Reading about Armstrong lead me to the wikipedia page for Christophe Bassons [1], a professional cyclist that called out Armstrong (and drug use in the profession). It is enraging to read that Bassons had to end his career early as a result of taking a stance against rampant cheating. What's particularly infuriating is that he likely got robbed of the opportunity to (perhaps) win a few titles, due to the unfair competition. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christophe_Bassons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christophe_Bassons

pasbesoin 9y ago
One of many aspects/details that have caused me to turn my back on professional sports -- formally declared or otherwise (college football, the Olympics, etc.). It would be inspiring if we could have professional sports-persons who could make a decent living extolling the virtues of sport and leading by example. "Decent" living -- not obscene incomes based upon monopolies and taxpayer extortion (stadium costs, tax exemptions, etc.) feeding yet greater ownership incomes (another form of rent-seeking, in its way). But instead, cash is king. And the virtues of sport get turned into vices -- whether practiced by the players, or upon them (e.g. football's heavy toll). I don't like this corruption. So I vote with my feet -- that is to say, with my dollars. Anyway, sport is meant for actual participation. Any professional level should build upon that. Not upon eyeballs and asses in seats (doing nothing).