7 ms·

Due process for punishment applied from public gov't bodies. However, people can and will reach conclusions based on the evidence laid before to make their judg

Due process for punishment applied from public gov't bodies. However, people can and will reach conclusions based on the evidence laid before to make their judgements to whether be Equifax customers or not. I realize this may seem like mob-mentality or mob-rule but there's some nuance here. When you see such gross negligence do you wait until hearings and court judgements which can easily take years before voting with your wallet?

glitcher 9y ago
Individual consumers did not choose to be Equifax customers, and as far as I know there is no way for me to "opt out" and effectively have all of my data removed from Equifax (including all future data).
- ianai 9y ago
  Yep. They're more of a defacto government than a corporation at this point.
- sjbase 9y ago
  True. Small comfort, but if you're a purchaser of credit rating data, you may have some flexibility in who you purchase from.
  - zentiggr 9y ago
    Won't make much difference in this new world of "assume that SSN is compromised, now what do you use?" I'm already trying to figure out how to push locally for dropping SSNs from processes, no matter how Sisyphean it feels.
- ams6110 9y ago
  The terms and conditions of any loan, credit card, or other credit account include a release or disclosure that covers reporting the account and payment history to credit reporting agencies. So technically, we did "opt-in" when we accepted credit. The way to "opt-out" is to never use credit.
  - omegaworks 9y ago
    This kind of contractual oligopoly should be explicitly disallowed. It's exactly the kind of place regulation should step in, much like it has with anti-competitive non-competes, forced-arbitration clauses, and IP-creator protections in some states.
  - jstarfish 9y ago
    That's not really fair though, as credit is only one facet of the data they collect on you. In most of the US it's against code to live in an apartment without electricity. In order to get electricity, you have to open an account with a utility, who opts-in to submit all your data to Equifax. Their Workforce Solutions division does the same thing with employment data-- so simply by applying for a job from a participating employer, you're consenting to ultimately let the employer report that you work for them, what your current salary is, your SSN and all the rest of the juicy PII. Fall on hard times? Need some government assistance? Applying for food stamps will also result in your state agency making an inquiry with Equifax to confirm your location of residence and last reported income. If you didn't have a profile before, you do now. There is no way to opt out unless you work for yourself, live in a home you paid cash for, generate your own power/gas, and never use credit. So basically Unabomber life.
    - ams6110 9y ago
      Well I didn't say it was fair or even reasonable. Just what is. There are stories of people who have trouble getting credit or renting an apartment, etc. because they have never had credit before and therefore have no credit report. So it seems that the reporting agencies don't know about people who don't use credit or any other services that report.
  - reaperducer 9y ago
    Asking for a loan or credit is the quickest route into these credit rating agency's databases. But their goal is to catalog and rate everyone, so you eventually get in there whether you ask for money or not.
sjbase 9y ago
Nope, I don't wait for courts when I think I have enough info to form my own opinion. I'm just as outraged about the Equifax breach as anyone else, and would never do business with them in any way. The key is, there's more evidence every day of negligence: the obvious authentication issues on their site, the "SSN API", the 4+ months that they didn't install the Apache security update, etc. For me personally, the trading issue is a related but separate incident; one hasn't crossed the same threshold of clear evidence.
ams6110 9y ago
No. There's no question that the breach happened; Equifax disclosed it. Who knew what, and when, and whether any stock sales were illegal, are matters for due process. Outrage over the breach itself and the clear negligence that caused it is a separate issue.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

glitcher 9y ago

Individual consumers did not choose to be Equifax customers, and as far as I know there is no way for me to "opt out" and effectively have all of my data removed from Equifax (including all future data).

ianai 9y ago
Yep. They're more of a defacto government than a corporation at this point.
sjbase 9y ago
True. Small comfort, but if you're a purchaser of credit rating data, you may have some flexibility in who you purchase from.
- zentiggr 9y ago
  Won't make much difference in this new world of "assume that SSN is compromised, now what do you use?" I'm already trying to figure out how to push locally for dropping SSNs from processes, no matter how Sisyphean it feels.
ams6110 9y ago
The terms and conditions of any loan, credit card, or other credit account include a release or disclosure that covers reporting the account and payment history to credit reporting agencies. So technically, we did "opt-in" when we accepted credit. The way to "opt-out" is to never use credit.
- omegaworks 9y ago
  This kind of contractual oligopoly should be explicitly disallowed. It's exactly the kind of place regulation should step in, much like it has with anti-competitive non-competes, forced-arbitration clauses, and IP-creator protections in some states.
- jstarfish 9y ago
  That's not really fair though, as credit is only one facet of the data they collect on you. In most of the US it's against code to live in an apartment without electricity. In order to get electricity, you have to open an account with a utility, who opts-in to submit all your data to Equifax. Their Workforce Solutions division does the same thing with employment data-- so simply by applying for a job from a participating employer, you're consenting to ultimately let the employer report that you work for them, what your current salary is, your SSN and all the rest of the juicy PII. Fall on hard times? Need some government assistance? Applying for food stamps will also result in your state agency making an inquiry with Equifax to confirm your location of residence and last reported income. If you didn't have a profile before, you do now. There is no way to opt out unless you work for yourself, live in a home you paid cash for, generate your own power/gas, and never use credit. So basically Unabomber life.
  - ams6110 9y ago
    Well I didn't say it was fair or even reasonable. Just what is. There are stories of people who have trouble getting credit or renting an apartment, etc. because they have never had credit before and therefore have no credit report. So it seems that the reporting agencies don't know about people who don't use credit or any other services that report.
- reaperducer 9y ago
  Asking for a loan or credit is the quickest route into these credit rating agency's databases. But their goal is to catalog and rate everyone, so you eventually get in there whether you ask for money or not.

sjbase 9y ago

Nope, I don't wait for courts when I think I have enough info to form my own opinion. I'm just as outraged about the Equifax breach as anyone else, and would never do business with them in any way. The key is, there's more evidence every day of negligence: the obvious authentication issues on their site, the "SSN API", the 4+ months that they didn't install the Apache security update, etc. For me personally, the trading issue is a related but separate incident; one hasn't crossed the same threshold of clear evidence.

ams6110 9y ago

No. There's no question that the breach happened; Equifax disclosed it. Who knew what, and when, and whether any stock sales were illegal, are matters for due process. Outrage over the breach itself and the clear negligence that caused it is a separate issue.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]