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Rolling Stone, Once a Counterculture Bible, Will Be Put Up for Sale
- Mediterraneo10 9y agoI like to read about the 1960s counterculture in Europe and North America. It was always funny to see Rolling Stone in the list of "underground newspapers" of the Sixties, because for my generation, it has always been a completely ordinary and conventional magazine that you can buy anywhere. Also amazing is that Time Out, which will strike most people today as an unremarkable and boring listing of events, was considered a key achievement of the London counterculture when it first came out. Apparently any countercultural vibe was gradually purged from it over the course of the 1970s.
- anvandare 9y ago"You either die a counterculture or you live long enough to become the culture." The young/anti-establishment people of the 60's and 70's are the old/establishment people of today.
- coldtea 9y agoAnd, at the same time, there are no young/anti-establishment people of today of any consequence. Not in any such numbers as to constitute an actual counter-culture anyway...
- iskander 9y agoThe anarchist scene has seemed thriving in every city I've lived in.
- coldtea 9y agoThriving in the sense that the goth scene is also thriving. It has a few places people hang out, occasionally they organize this or that, and they have a good time. Other than that just as insignificant, in influence, in power, in numbers and in mass appeal as the juggalo scene. Not much to write home about.
- VLM 9y agoAlt-right elected a president against incredible legacy media opposition...
- yardie 9y agoThe alt-right didn't get him elected. Good ol' American racism did. They certainly helped. But what helped more was he had a solid pulse on scared white men.
- yung_endian 9y agoNot just white men - trump won with all categories of people identifying as white
- yardie 9y agoYes. And the narrative is his inauguration was an anomaly. That somehow the alt-right managed to get him elected. But there is nothing alt about securing over 70% of white male voters.
- seabta 9y agoScared? Or don't think the change in demographics is in the interest of their descendants?
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- JBReefer 9y agoI think it's shocking how normative the culture is today. Fringe media says exactly the same things - pro-social justice, pro-a large social safety net, deep concern about climate change - as the major media. The only actual "counterculture" seems to be Breitbart et al, which is ... a change. Paper Magazine, the New York Times, and Gothamist now mostly reflect the same cultural ideals. It's fascinating. Was this what the 80s was like?
- cvwright 9y agoFunny that you mention Breitbart. Their founder Andrew Breitbart claimed that he helped start Huffington Post in an effort to show that mainstream news sources (NY Times etc) actually share most of the views of groups toward the far left, ie the former counterculture. Was he successful? He certainly convinced most of the people on the right, but they were already on his bandwagon anyway... As someone in the middle, it's looking more and more like he had a point. (Even if the site that bears his name has become.. well, whatever it is, now.)
- tclancy 9y agoIs that true? It's not like effective counter-culture stuff is ever easily recognizable by older generations. Otherwise it wouldn't be fun. Remember ever cool word/ term you knew as a kid and how they immediately stopped being cool once you heard your parents use them?
- coldtea 9y ago>It's not like effective counter-culture stuff is ever easily recognizable by older generations. It might not be easily understood, but it's usually both easily recognizable and frequently condemned. We're not talking about some secret society, but about major currents for change. >Remember ever cool word/ term you knew as a kid and how they immediately stopped being cool once you heard your parents use them? Yes. That's pop culture. Not anti-establishment culture.
- yung_endian 9y ago>And, at the same time, there are no young/anti-establishment people of today of any consequence LGBTQ spaces and movements? Black Lives Matter? Occupy Wall St and the subsequent progressive upswell which led to Bernie Sanders, an unknown independent from Vermont, to garner nearly as many votes as one of the most well-known politicians on the planet?
- coldtea 9y agoThose are so tame, popular and media-friendly that are their own part of the modern establishment. Furthermore, they focus on small niches (gender, police brutality, etc) and are otherwise totally content with modern society. And OWS died before it was even born -- the best it could manage to was to prop up an alternative Democratic candidate (that would have given the same kind of fake "Hope" Obama ended up delivering to those that believed in him). If tame middle aged people who listen to Enya and mass media outlets can root for your cause, you're not exactly a counter-culture.
- hsod 9y ago> Furthermore, they focus on small niches (gender, police brutality, etc) Neither of these is a small niche. Police brutality is a huge, huge issue. It may seem like a small niche to people who are not members of targeted demographics, though. > and are otherwise totally content with modern society. What leads you to believe this? From my personal experience this couldn't be more wrong Anyway, if you want real counter culture that middle aged people will still clutch their pearls over... what about Antifa?
- coldtea 9y ago>It may seem like a small niche to people who are not members of targeted demographics, though. I'm not saying it's not important -- but as a request for change it is niche in scope, that is constrained to a small area of life (even if you are one of the targeted demographics). >What leads you to believe this?* Well, some internet ranting and rare protesting aside I don't see any alternative lifestyles there (or only very trite ones, the "fair trade coffee" equivalent of politics). It's all business as usual otherwise. >Anyway, if you want real counter culture that middle aged people will still clutch their pearls over... what about Antifa? Better in the shocks middle aged people respect, but scores less points on "culture". It's a reaction-based group, not an alternative cultural force.
- Allower 9y agoSounds pretty. but i dont really buy it. Maybe SOME of their ideas have been absorbed into western cultures, but many have not, many continue to be anti-establishment ideas today.
- Angostura 9y agoPrivate Eye has done a pretty good job of maintaining the vibe.
- Mediterraneo10 9y agoPrivate Eye was never really countercultural. When Richard Neville, founder of the legendary 1960s countercultural newspaper OZ, moved to London, he met with Private Eye staff thinking that they might be on the same wavelength. Instead, he found they were very classist and old-fashioned (and homophobic). The counterculture wanted to utterly tear down the establishment. Private Eye might have poked fun at some establishment figures, but that doesn’t mean it had the same revolutionary aims as the true counterculture.
- Angostura 9y agoThis is a fair point.
- sortaThrowaway 9y agoWas on and off reader of RS. Their non/half apology for their University of Virginia rape story really turn me off. They didn't seem to understand (or care?) what they did wrong and thus didn't really apologize.
- cdolan 9y agoI also do not think the author or editor were removed from their positions
- coldtea 9y agoWhy should they? Should everybody that makes a mistake in their job be fired? The magazine retracted the story and apologized. The author apologized as well. The editor handed over their resignation (it was not accepted). What do you want, to have them be some parriahs that never find journalistic work again?
- dforrestwilson 9y agoI think it's partly an issue with retractions. Information can be kind of insidious, even when the consumer knows it is false. Fox news does tons of retractions (of course), but it's the way they do it that really tells you what they are about. I'm all for free speech, but I wish we could get a handle on people saying completely wrong things for profit.
- cdolan 9y agoPerhaps this is why the Rolling Stone is for sale then? Author and Editor fail to validate highly sensitive claims in an incredibly amateur fashion. * they did not even ask the accused for comment*. Rather than separate from the author and Editor, and help them find a career elsewhere, the publication gives a pretty weak apology and doubles down on two individuals who obviously failed to follow basic journalism standards. They don't need to be "parriahs", but I do think it rubbed readers the wrong way when RS continued to defend their work and ultimately gave a sour retraction ('we were hoodwinked!') and weak "sorry!".
- RickJWagner 9y agoIronically reported in the Failing New York Times. :)
- trumpownsyou420 9y agoNew for idiots, by idiots©
- thisiscool 9y agoSeems to me the NY Times is doing OK, digital subscriptions are way up.
- VeejayRampay 9y agoMost likely the parent was using the phrase in jest.
- janvdberg 9y agoJann Wenner was on a recent How I Built This podcast [1]: which was very interesting. He was very adamant there that his son was being prepped to take over. So this is a bit surprising. [1] http://www.npr.org/podcasts/510313/how-i-built-this http://www.npr.org/podcasts/510313/how-i-built-this
- brookside 9y agoHe struck me as prickly and on edge for portions of that interview. While the question about lack of gender diversity in RS's writers seemed aggressive compared to the normal How I Built This "So a billion dollar valuation. That's a lot of money. What does it feel like to be...rich?", Wenner's response seemed out of touch and dismissive.
- thisiscool 9y ago2 things caused me to decline a Rolling Stones subscription which I just cannot get over: 1. A Rape on Campus 2. the Marathon bomber on the cover looking like a rock star
- fallingfrog 9y agoRolling Stone has become a sad graveyard of top 50 songs lists and photos from the 60's. It's a joke for anyone under the age of 50.
- Myrmornis 9y agoYou might be unaware of some of the good journalism on non-music current affairs that they have published, e.g. Matt Taibbi.
- olivermarks 9y agoThe only reason I ever go to RS online is to read Matt Taibbi, who has been a valuable documenter of our era of too big to fail bank antics and the bizarre US political circus. The rest of it seems run of the mill corporate entertainment shilling and promotion...
- Myrmornis 9y agoYep, what have the Romans ever done for us? :) What about, going back a bit, but David Foster Wallace's piece on John McCain's election campaign?
- thanatropism 9y agoIn a different (but intersecting) market, _Outside_ magazine is very good.
- mikestew 9y agoOutside, the magazine that just published a puff piece on Lance Armstrong that ended up on HN somehow? Yeah, that magazine has become about as vapid as RS has.