4 ms·

It's worth noting that the perpetrator in the bloomberg article had a fake driver's license in the name of the victim. So ID cards aren't a complete solution ei

by harryh 9y ago

It's worth noting that the perpetrator in the bloomberg article had a fake driver's license in the name of the victim. So ID cards aren't a complete solution either.

mcguire 9y ago
Not to mention the other documents from the GP.
u801e 9y ago
Couldn't they verify the authenticity of the drivers license by contacting the department of motor vehicles? One shouldn't verify documents unless you're a member of the organization that issued them.
- djsumdog 9y ago
  It was most likely a real license. Credit checks use the DL number. You need an SSN card to get a license or ID card and the SSN card is gained using security questions and has no photo, fingerprints or biometrics associated with it. I remember needing to get a new SSN card once and it was creepy how easy it was.
  - mgkimsal 9y ago
    Comparing photo on dl with photo from DMV might help.
djsumdog 9y ago
But you get that ID card using an SSN card. Other countries have a photo attached to your nation ID card and citizen identification number (and sometimes fingerprints too). But think about America right now. Do you honestly think we could get national ID numbers? Could you imagine people being asked for a DNA swab or fingerprint to establish their identity? The blow black would be monstrous, and I don't think it'd be entirely unjustified. With 1% of our population incarcerated or on probation, with no national health care and being the largest state sponsor of terrorism in the world, there is good reason for Americans not to trust their government. Add in all the fundie religious people crying "sign of the beast" and Alex Jones followers yelling "national RFID chips" and you're stuck with a situation that cannot change.
- chimeracoder 9y ago
  > But you get that ID card using an SSN card. Not necessarily. Not all states require an SSN in order to issue an ID. > But think about America right now. Do you honestly think we could get national ID numbers? Unfortunately (for all the reasons you mentioned and more), we're pretty close, as the REAL ID system is about to take effect. That's going to be a huge problem for people living in the states that don't issue REAL IDs. It's also going to be a problem for legal immigrants and transgender people in every state.
  - uiri 9y ago
    Not all states require an SSN in order to issue an ID. I was under the impression that every single state requires an SSN to issue a driver's license or id card in order to track and enforce child support order across state lines. Which states don't require an SSN to issue an ID? Legal immigrants have passports, and ID cards/driver's licenses from their home country. I'm not sure what will require two forms of REAL ID compliant identification.
    - chimeracoder 9y ago
      > I was under the impression that every single state requires an SSN to issue a driver's license or id card in order to track and enforce child support order across state lines. Nope. If they did, the impetus behind the REAL ID act wouldn't even be relevant, because illegal immigrants wouldn't be able to obtain a drivers' license or state ID. > Which states don't require an SSN to issue an ID? California is the biggest one, and in fact, California makes it illegal to discriminate against anyone who has a driver's license but cannot show legal residency. Some states mark licenses as "not valid for identification" if they don't show legal residency, but it's usually subtle and easily overlooked or ignored. And the SSN isn't the only way to show legal residency, either. > Legal immigrants have passports, and ID cards/driver's licenses from their home country. For foreigners, passports are the only acceptable form of identification from foreign governments. Driver's licenses and other government IDs are not allowed, with the exception of driver's licenses from Canada.

by harryh 9y ago

It's worth noting that the perpetrator in the bloomberg article had a fake driver's license in the name of the victim. So ID cards aren't a complete solution either.

mcguire 9y ago

Not to mention the other documents from the GP.

u801e 9y ago

Couldn't they verify the authenticity of the drivers license by contacting the department of motor vehicles? One shouldn't verify documents unless you're a member of the organization that issued them.

djsumdog 9y ago
It was most likely a real license. Credit checks use the DL number. You need an SSN card to get a license or ID card and the SSN card is gained using security questions and has no photo, fingerprints or biometrics associated with it. I remember needing to get a new SSN card once and it was creepy how easy it was.
- mgkimsal 9y ago
  Comparing photo on dl with photo from DMV might help.

djsumdog 9y ago

But you get that ID card using an SSN card. Other countries have a photo attached to your nation ID card and citizen identification number (and sometimes fingerprints too). But think about America right now. Do you honestly think we could get national ID numbers? Could you imagine people being asked for a DNA swab or fingerprint to establish their identity? The blow black would be monstrous, and I don't think it'd be entirely unjustified. With 1% of our population incarcerated or on probation, with no national health care and being the largest state sponsor of terrorism in the world, there is good reason for Americans not to trust their government. Add in all the fundie religious people crying "sign of the beast" and Alex Jones followers yelling "national RFID chips" and you're stuck with a situation that cannot change.

chimeracoder 9y ago
> But you get that ID card using an SSN card. Not necessarily. Not all states require an SSN in order to issue an ID. > But think about America right now. Do you honestly think we could get national ID numbers? Unfortunately (for all the reasons you mentioned and more), we're pretty close, as the REAL ID system is about to take effect. That's going to be a huge problem for people living in the states that don't issue REAL IDs. It's also going to be a problem for legal immigrants and transgender people in every state.
- uiri 9y ago
  Not all states require an SSN in order to issue an ID. I was under the impression that every single state requires an SSN to issue a driver's license or id card in order to track and enforce child support order across state lines. Which states don't require an SSN to issue an ID? Legal immigrants have passports, and ID cards/driver's licenses from their home country. I'm not sure what will require two forms of REAL ID compliant identification.
  - chimeracoder 9y ago
    > I was under the impression that every single state requires an SSN to issue a driver's license or id card in order to track and enforce child support order across state lines. Nope. If they did, the impetus behind the REAL ID act wouldn't even be relevant, because illegal immigrants wouldn't be able to obtain a drivers' license or state ID. > Which states don't require an SSN to issue an ID? California is the biggest one, and in fact, California makes it illegal to discriminate against anyone who has a driver's license but cannot show legal residency. Some states mark licenses as "not valid for identification" if they don't show legal residency, but it's usually subtle and easily overlooked or ignored. And the SSN isn't the only way to show legal residency, either. > Legal immigrants have passports, and ID cards/driver's licenses from their home country. For foreigners, passports are the only acceptable form of identification from foreign governments. Driver's licenses and other government IDs are not allowed, with the exception of driver's licenses from Canada.