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> The myth that just won't die. If this were true, salaries would be skyrocketing, companies wouldn't have the luxury of being as picky as they are, and open re

> The myth that just won't die. If this were true, salaries would be skyrocketing, companies wouldn't have the luxury of being as picky as they are, and open reqs wouldn't attract hundreds of applicants. I don't know whether to think it is real, or that it is a myth. It's true that tech companies are picky, it's true that salaries are not skyrocketing. Open reqs attract hundreds of unqualified applicants, at least, that was my impression. > With no alternatives, you have little power to negotiate: you take it or leave it. I just wanted to add, this is inline with my experience. It is difficult to get multiple offers to align in the manner suggested.

sokoloff 9y ago
> Open reqs attract hundreds of unqualified applicants, at least, that was my impression. Matches my experience on the hiring side. Even after we filter heavily long before they get to me, within the last month, had a candidate for a senior software position who literally asked "What is AWS?" I can only presume that guy files loads of applications and goes on every interview he's offered.
- Clubber 9y ago
  Are you paying market rates? If so, how are you calculating market rates? Also, if you are paying market rates, why would you expect anyone really talented to select your company over all the other ones that pay market rates? (I'm not trying to be snide).
  - sokoloff 9y ago
    I believe so and this guy was just an outlier dud who BS'd his way to an on-site round. Fresh college hires are making 6-figures and it goes up from there, quickly. We use an HR market data firm to inform our hiring managers, but if you spend enough time in the market, you get to learn when you're never losing a candidate over comp or when you're frequently losing them over comp or getting strong counter proposals. I trust the intel we get from the candidates and market over what we get from the HR research company. (Boston market.)
    - Clubber 9y ago
      It sounds like you are doing it right. I only personally know two really good people. One is my mentor, the other I made my business partner. Good luck.
  - deathanatos 9y ago
    As an engineer, I do the interviewing, but I have no insight into salary details. I have no idea what my coworkers are paid, were hired for, how much this candidate thinks he is worth or is asking, or what we've promised or advertised through recruiters, etc.
mc32 9y ago
>Open reqs attract hundreds of unqualified applicants, at least, that was my impression. In that case, what you can do is train your underqualified candidates. Create a system which allows you to train candidates for training and get them up to speed. Kind of like manufacturing used to do.
- deathanatos 9y ago
  I actually think apprenticeships would be a great system for software engineering. I'm in no position to implement it, however.
eli_gottlieb 9y ago
>I don't know whether to think it is real, or that it is a myth. It's true that tech companies are picky, it's true that salaries are not skyrocketing. Open reqs attract hundreds of unqualified applicants, at least, that was my impression. Then you should probably hurry up and skyrocket your salaries.
- deathanatos 9y ago
  Thus far, the only way I've found to do this is by changing jobs. I've been somewhat successful at it, I think, but that somewhat puts a limit on how frequently I can do this, and I'm not fond of the negotiating. The world would be a better place if people just paid people what they were worth. If we could start having more honest conversations about salary (e.g., talking about salary, and comparing salaries should not be taboo…), I think it'd go a long ways.

sokoloff 9y ago

> Open reqs attract hundreds of unqualified applicants, at least, that was my impression. Matches my experience on the hiring side. Even after we filter heavily long before they get to me, within the last month, had a candidate for a senior software position who literally asked "What is AWS?" I can only presume that guy files loads of applications and goes on every interview he's offered.

Clubber 9y ago
Are you paying market rates? If so, how are you calculating market rates? Also, if you are paying market rates, why would you expect anyone really talented to select your company over all the other ones that pay market rates? (I'm not trying to be snide).
- sokoloff 9y ago
  I believe so and this guy was just an outlier dud who BS'd his way to an on-site round. Fresh college hires are making 6-figures and it goes up from there, quickly. We use an HR market data firm to inform our hiring managers, but if you spend enough time in the market, you get to learn when you're never losing a candidate over comp or when you're frequently losing them over comp or getting strong counter proposals. I trust the intel we get from the candidates and market over what we get from the HR research company. (Boston market.)
  - Clubber 9y ago
    It sounds like you are doing it right. I only personally know two really good people. One is my mentor, the other I made my business partner. Good luck.
- deathanatos 9y ago
  As an engineer, I do the interviewing, but I have no insight into salary details. I have no idea what my coworkers are paid, were hired for, how much this candidate thinks he is worth or is asking, or what we've promised or advertised through recruiters, etc.

mc32 9y ago

>Open reqs attract hundreds of unqualified applicants, at least, that was my impression. In that case, what you can do is train your underqualified candidates. Create a system which allows you to train candidates for training and get them up to speed. Kind of like manufacturing used to do.

deathanatos 9y ago
I actually think apprenticeships would be a great system for software engineering. I'm in no position to implement it, however.

eli_gottlieb 9y ago

>I don't know whether to think it is real, or that it is a myth. It's true that tech companies are picky, it's true that salaries are not skyrocketing. Open reqs attract hundreds of unqualified applicants, at least, that was my impression. Then you should probably hurry up and skyrocket your salaries.

deathanatos 9y ago
Thus far, the only way I've found to do this is by changing jobs. I've been somewhat successful at it, I think, but that somewhat puts a limit on how frequently I can do this, and I'm not fond of the negotiating. The world would be a better place if people just paid people what they were worth. If we could start having more honest conversations about salary (e.g., talking about salary, and comparing salaries should not be taboo…), I think it'd go a long ways.