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So you hate to be that guy but you still feel like coming here to state your absolutely empty point of view without even a hint of an argument? This isn't the p

So you hate to be that guy but you still feel like coming here to state your absolutely empty point of view without even a hint of an argument? This isn't the place for hate speech or for pouring your negativism. This is a beautiful project by beautiful people dedicated to an open mobile solution which the world dramatically needs. Let's give them strength and share only our best constructive criticism.

deleted 9y ago
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carussell 9y ago
Constructive criticism is not the same thing as positivism—especially unconditional positivism. Withholding advice because it might sound negative is the opposite of constructive. Saying, "don't do that; you'll die!" is almost always constructive, for example. Imagine being told to bite your tongue and be supportive after your friend has announced their intent to run through traffic to get to the shop across the street.
- prophesi 9y ago
  Nah, "don't do that; you'll die because you may get hit by traffic!" is constructive criticism. You have to give a reason for your positivity or negativity.
  - carussell 9y ago
    I don't think we're going to agree if you think that "don't do that; you'll die!" is unconstructive hate speech and better left unsaid.
    - prophesi 9y ago
      It's not hate speech, but definitely not constructive. And whether it's best left unsaid depends on the situation. Your street-crosser probably hasn't invested hours upon hours of time on researching and developing how they're going to run across the street.
whalesalad 9y ago
Hate speech? Really? I didn't say anything at all hateful. I'm simply suggesting that this will not succeed. I'll dig in. There is a good reason that a lot of these libre/free/open tools do not succeed. It's simple: the value that they provide does not outweigh their cost. The juice is not worth the squeeze. Let's observe the quick facts: Does not run Google Android Does not run Apple iOS This is a double edged sword. For the tin-hat folks, this is great. For everyone else, how am I going to get applications for this platform, without building them myself? Runs PureOS by default, can run most GNU+Linux distributions Great for folks who want Linux on their cell phone. I love Linux, but I am pretty sure that marketshare is something like 3.4% right now. World’s first ever IP-native mobile handset What does this do for me? What value does this provide? It's just a technical bullet point with no relevance whatsoever. End-to-end decentralized communications via Matrix Again, what is this? This is a bullet point devoid of meaning or value. Is this a new communication platform/protocol that I am going to need to get my friends and family to use? What if they use iPhone and Android? 5″ screen Finally, something interesting. Security focused by design Would prefer seeing how this differs from the current product landscape. As far as I can tell, the iPhone is security focused. You can't unlock it without my fingerprint. Applications are sandboxed. I don't think my iPhone was designed without security in mind. Privacy protection by default Here is another meaningless line. What does this mean? What value does this give me? Works with 2G/3G/4G, GSM, UMTS, and LTE networks Okay, here is the second meaningful feature. CPU separate from Baseband I can imagine that this is helpful for security: but why? What value does this give me? Hardware Kill Switches for Camera, Microphone, WiFi/Bluetooth, and Baseband This is another interesting feature. So after looking through this entire Librem 5 page I have found two or three meaningful features. Two of them are arguably table stakes, the 5" screen and the supported networks. I'm sorry but the entire page exhibits a sense of extremist tin-hat individuals living in an alternate reality from the rest of us. That is why I feel as though this will be a flop.
- fabrice_d 9y ago
  "I'm sorry but the entire page exhibits a sense of extremist tin-hat individuals living in an alternate reality from the rest of us. That is why I feel as though this will be a flop." I would not use "extremist tin-hat individuals", but yes this project caters to people that are ready to make some compromises to not betray their ideals. Where you put the line of what you are ready to compromise on is the key. What I like though is that if the HW is good enough and open, nothing should prevent from porting something less "extreme", like AOSP or something derived from FirefoxOS. So just for that possibility, they need to be supported!

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

carussell 9y ago

Constructive criticism is not the same thing as positivism—especially unconditional positivism. Withholding advice because it might sound negative is the opposite of constructive. Saying, "don't do that; you'll die!" is almost always constructive, for example. Imagine being told to bite your tongue and be supportive after your friend has announced their intent to run through traffic to get to the shop across the street.

prophesi 9y ago
Nah, "don't do that; you'll die because you may get hit by traffic!" is constructive criticism. You have to give a reason for your positivity or negativity.
- carussell 9y ago
  I don't think we're going to agree if you think that "don't do that; you'll die!" is unconstructive hate speech and better left unsaid.
  - prophesi 9y ago
    It's not hate speech, but definitely not constructive. And whether it's best left unsaid depends on the situation. Your street-crosser probably hasn't invested hours upon hours of time on researching and developing how they're going to run across the street.

whalesalad 9y ago

Hate speech? Really? I didn't say anything at all hateful. I'm simply suggesting that this will not succeed. I'll dig in. There is a good reason that a lot of these libre/free/open tools do not succeed. It's simple: the value that they provide does not outweigh their cost. The juice is not worth the squeeze. Let's observe the quick facts: Does not run Google Android Does not run Apple iOS This is a double edged sword. For the tin-hat folks, this is great. For everyone else, how am I going to get applications for this platform, without building them myself? Runs PureOS by default, can run most GNU+Linux distributions Great for folks who want Linux on their cell phone. I love Linux, but I am pretty sure that marketshare is something like 3.4% right now. World’s first ever IP-native mobile handset What does this do for me? What value does this provide? It's just a technical bullet point with no relevance whatsoever. End-to-end decentralized communications via Matrix Again, what is this? This is a bullet point devoid of meaning or value. Is this a new communication platform/protocol that I am going to need to get my friends and family to use? What if they use iPhone and Android? 5″ screen Finally, something interesting. Security focused by design Would prefer seeing how this differs from the current product landscape. As far as I can tell, the iPhone is security focused. You can't unlock it without my fingerprint. Applications are sandboxed. I don't think my iPhone was designed without security in mind. Privacy protection by default Here is another meaningless line. What does this mean? What value does this give me? Works with 2G/3G/4G, GSM, UMTS, and LTE networks Okay, here is the second meaningful feature. CPU separate from Baseband I can imagine that this is helpful for security: but why? What value does this give me? Hardware Kill Switches for Camera, Microphone, WiFi/Bluetooth, and Baseband This is another interesting feature. So after looking through this entire Librem 5 page I have found two or three meaningful features. Two of them are arguably table stakes, the 5" screen and the supported networks. I'm sorry but the entire page exhibits a sense of extremist tin-hat individuals living in an alternate reality from the rest of us. That is why I feel as though this will be a flop.

fabrice_d 9y ago
"I'm sorry but the entire page exhibits a sense of extremist tin-hat individuals living in an alternate reality from the rest of us. That is why I feel as though this will be a flop." I would not use "extremist tin-hat individuals", but yes this project caters to people that are ready to make some compromises to not betray their ideals. Where you put the line of what you are ready to compromise on is the key. What I like though is that if the HW is good enough and open, nothing should prevent from porting something less "extreme", like AOSP or something derived from FirefoxOS. So just for that possibility, they need to be supported!