4 ms·

spacemacs is solid if you want to try out a well configured emacs. magit, org mode, helm are amazing tools and part of the killer feature list of emacs. magit

spacemacs is solid if you want to try out a well configured emacs. magit, org mode, helm are amazing tools and part of the killer feature list of emacs. magit is so good even if I stopped using emacs tomorrow I would still use it for my git gui. http://www.spacemacs.org http://www.spacemacs.org

coldtea 9y ago
I try such distros every two years or so to see if it's gotten any better. Usually it's not worth my time from the start (fun thing is, I used to use Emacs for a year or so in uni, before turning to Vim and never looking back -- until I had to do Java, which meant Eclipse. I got back to Vim, but the last 5 years it's all ST with some sporadic attempts to like VSC). Let's do this in realtime. I downloaded the latest Spacemacs. 1) Opening. Hmm, it's a zip not a DMG. Already losing me, but I'll stick, I'm not that shallow. 2) Hmm, it's just a bunch of source files? I guess the prominent "Download" link just gives you the configuration, not a bundled editor. I have to get Emacs from somewhere else. Grr... Lemme check their "Quickstart". 3) Yeah... the Quickstart link just gives you some BS that assumes you already know how to install this, and the "Install" button just gives a git command line to clone their repo. Back to square 1. 4) Fuck it, I'll use brew to install Emacs. Spacemacs doesn't even say which version of Emacs it works best with. I'll risk with what brew gives me. 5) Brew installation ends fine, with a caveat: "Please try the Cask for a better-supported Cocoa version". Now you tell me? 6) Anyway, I have an emacs, lemme git clone spacemacs now. OK, comes up, nice logo. Now, I have a huge emacs window -- so why is it asking me "first time" config questions in a tiny space at the bottom? And why doesn't it explain better what the various options (distro flavors) entail? 7) Let it do its install, then play around a bit. Close the window in evil mode (q!). I open emacs again, greeted with this: Found 1 new package(s) to install... --> refreshing package archive: gnu... [3/3] --> installing package: evil-unimpaired@spacemacs-evil... [1/1] An error occurred while installing evil-unimpaired (error: (wrong-type- argument package-desc nil)) Oh, and: Warnings: - Cannot find any of the specified fonts (Source Code Pro)! Font settings may not be correct. 8) I open some local source files to check. A buffer window appears on the right side with "warnings": Error (use-package): helm :config: Symbol’s value as variable is void: helm-bookmark-map Yeah, fuck that. Back to ST3.
- mjmein 9y ago
  That's actually a pretty good barrier to entry. With emacs/spacemacs, if installing it is too frustrating for you, then configuring and using it is going to be way too frustrating for you.
  - coldtea 9y ago
    Yes. And god forbid it plays out of the box end to end with configuration/elisp being totally optional.
    - weaksauce 9y ago
      For the most part it is completely optional to configure it and use elisp... it will ask you if you want to install a layer (group of packages) when you open up a filetype that it knows about and can handle. there is some configuration akin to setting up completion backend, linters, formatters etc that are applicable to your language/filetype of choice. The benefit of that is that the external tools are kept external where development of them can continue unimpeded by the development of the main text editor. similarly, once you get to know the language quirks, it's a decent language that is basically a DSL for text editing. The power you get from being able to lookup how something was implemented by the text editor developers easily is extremely powerful. If you like vim's idea of modal editing, emacs is 100% all about that. languages are major modes, minor modes are functions and keybindings that can be enabled and grouped together at will. transient buffers are used to send output to and are treated as normal buffers that you can do things to. The architecture and extensiblity of emacs is pretty amazing actually. Every key press is just a function and every key can be rebound based on current context using things like mode maps that get layered on top of everything and have precedence based on where you inserted the binding with sensible fallbacks when required. Disclaimer: I love vim as a concept but hate viml and the plugins that were hampered by the lame programming language that was designed by bram. if you have not tried magit and org mode you just don't really understand the power of emacs and the power of having everything be a function. spacemacs just makes setting up that powerful environment fairly painless but it's still a very old architecture with some warts.
    - 9y ago

coldtea 9y ago

I try such distros every two years or so to see if it's gotten any better. Usually it's not worth my time from the start (fun thing is, I used to use Emacs for a year or so in uni, before turning to Vim and never looking back -- until I had to do Java, which meant Eclipse. I got back to Vim, but the last 5 years it's all ST with some sporadic attempts to like VSC). Let's do this in realtime. I downloaded the latest Spacemacs. 1) Opening. Hmm, it's a zip not a DMG. Already losing me, but I'll stick, I'm not that shallow. 2) Hmm, it's just a bunch of source files? I guess the prominent "Download" link just gives you the configuration, not a bundled editor. I have to get Emacs from somewhere else. Grr... Lemme check their "Quickstart". 3) Yeah... the Quickstart link just gives you some BS that assumes you already know how to install this, and the "Install" button just gives a git command line to clone their repo. Back to square 1. 4) Fuck it, I'll use brew to install Emacs. Spacemacs doesn't even say which version of Emacs it works best with. I'll risk with what brew gives me. 5) Brew installation ends fine, with a caveat: "Please try the Cask for a better-supported Cocoa version". Now you tell me? 6) Anyway, I have an emacs, lemme git clone spacemacs now. OK, comes up, nice logo. Now, I have a huge emacs window -- so why is it asking me "first time" config questions in a tiny space at the bottom? And why doesn't it explain better what the various options (distro flavors) entail? 7) Let it do its install, then play around a bit. Close the window in evil mode (q!). I open emacs again, greeted with this: Found 1 new package(s) to install... --> refreshing package archive: gnu... [3/3] --> installing package: evil-unimpaired@spacemacs-evil... [1/1] An error occurred while installing evil-unimpaired (error: (wrong-type- argument package-desc nil)) Oh, and: Warnings: - Cannot find any of the specified fonts (Source Code Pro)! Font settings may not be correct. 8) I open some local source files to check. A buffer window appears on the right side with "warnings": Error (use-package): helm :config: Symbol’s value as variable is void: helm-bookmark-map Yeah, fuck that. Back to ST3.

mjmein 9y ago
That's actually a pretty good barrier to entry. With emacs/spacemacs, if installing it is too frustrating for you, then configuring and using it is going to be way too frustrating for you.
- coldtea 9y ago
  Yes. And god forbid it plays out of the box end to end with configuration/elisp being totally optional.
  - weaksauce 9y ago
    For the most part it is completely optional to configure it and use elisp... it will ask you if you want to install a layer (group of packages) when you open up a filetype that it knows about and can handle. there is some configuration akin to setting up completion backend, linters, formatters etc that are applicable to your language/filetype of choice. The benefit of that is that the external tools are kept external where development of them can continue unimpeded by the development of the main text editor. similarly, once you get to know the language quirks, it's a decent language that is basically a DSL for text editing. The power you get from being able to lookup how something was implemented by the text editor developers easily is extremely powerful. If you like vim's idea of modal editing, emacs is 100% all about that. languages are major modes, minor modes are functions and keybindings that can be enabled and grouped together at will. transient buffers are used to send output to and are treated as normal buffers that you can do things to. The architecture and extensiblity of emacs is pretty amazing actually. Every key press is just a function and every key can be rebound based on current context using things like mode maps that get layered on top of everything and have precedence based on where you inserted the binding with sensible fallbacks when required. Disclaimer: I love vim as a concept but hate viml and the plugins that were hampered by the lame programming language that was designed by bram. if you have not tried magit and org mode you just don't really understand the power of emacs and the power of having everything be a function. spacemacs just makes setting up that powerful environment fairly painless but it's still a very old architecture with some warts.
  - 9y ago