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> social housing, preschools, and savings & loans associations Those all sound like laudable charities. What about that is "outsized"?

yorwba 9y ago
It's outsized for a single organization that tends to attach its own package of values to everything. If a Muslim organization were to provide similar charity at similar scale, I'm pretty sure it would be interpreted as failure of the state. I'm not opposed to religious charity per se, but when it goes to church-run organizations, there tends to be a bit of missionaryizing on the side.
- LyndsySimon 9y ago
  > If a Muslim organization were to provide similar charity at similar scale I was under the impression that Muslim organizations do provide these services at a similar scale.
  - vidarh 9y ago
    Hamas being a notable example, where their non-military wing runs hospitals and schools and the like. It's a large part of the explanation for their support. And if the West had paid attention, we might also have realised that the best way of overcoming groups like Hamas is to strip them of the halo that comes from these services: Improve social services in areas where these kind organisations operate - just like we did in the West - and their recruitment base will diminish.
    - icebraining 9y ago
      Why would you think it's a matter of lack of comprehension? In such a disproportionate conflict, the vulnerability of the West is local popular opinion. The fact that the population supports Hamas is a great way to justify repressive measures.
      - vidarh 9y ago
        Because I regularly come across people who are utterly confused over how anyone could support these groups, because they believe the only thing they do is terror.
  - yorwba 9y ago
    And the states where they do it tend to be regarded as failures in the West. I was talking more in the context of the European countries named, where the usual expectation is that no charity should be required to provide these services.

yorwba 9y ago

It's outsized for a single organization that tends to attach its own package of values to everything. If a Muslim organization were to provide similar charity at similar scale, I'm pretty sure it would be interpreted as failure of the state. I'm not opposed to religious charity per se, but when it goes to church-run organizations, there tends to be a bit of missionaryizing on the side.

LyndsySimon 9y ago
> If a Muslim organization were to provide similar charity at similar scale I was under the impression that Muslim organizations do provide these services at a similar scale.
- vidarh 9y ago
  Hamas being a notable example, where their non-military wing runs hospitals and schools and the like. It's a large part of the explanation for their support. And if the West had paid attention, we might also have realised that the best way of overcoming groups like Hamas is to strip them of the halo that comes from these services: Improve social services in areas where these kind organisations operate - just like we did in the West - and their recruitment base will diminish.
  - icebraining 9y ago
    Why would you think it's a matter of lack of comprehension? In such a disproportionate conflict, the vulnerability of the West is local popular opinion. The fact that the population supports Hamas is a great way to justify repressive measures.
    - vidarh 9y ago
      Because I regularly come across people who are utterly confused over how anyone could support these groups, because they believe the only thing they do is terror.
- yorwba 9y ago
  And the states where they do it tend to be regarded as failures in the West. I was talking more in the context of the European countries named, where the usual expectation is that no charity should be required to provide these services.