6 ms·

How alcohol industry organisations mislead the public about alcohol and cancer

107 points by kawera 9y ago

chewyland 9y ago
Cancer or not, I really should stop drinking.
- whistlerbrk 9y ago
  Good luck, start exercising if you are not.
  - agumonkey 9y ago
    Also never "stop", slow down, allow for pauses, allow for minute amounts, as long as you keep decreasing.
    - fergonco 9y ago
      In the case of an alcohol addiction, decrease of consumption is almost a guarantee to relapse.
      - hyperpape 9y ago
        While zero consumption is probably the best, the belief that it's all or nothing seems to be associated with severity of relapse/bingeing after a failure of self-control http://persweb.wabash.edu/facstaff/hortonr/articles%20for%20class/baumeister%20and%20heatherton.pdf http://persweb.wabash.edu/facstaff/hortonr/articles%20for%20...
    - pg314 9y ago
      I found it much easier to completely eliminate alcohol than to reduce my consumption. You no longer have to think about it, and you're no longer tempted by 'just one more drink' (which becomes even more tempting after a couple of drinks).
      - BartSaM 9y ago
        Everyone is different. I also prefer just stop, but not everyone has will power to do so.
      - agumonkey 9y ago
        I didn't mean to reduce as a goal, but to not hurt yourself emotionally if you ever skip a beat as long as its tiny. If you finally drink once after a month of being sober, you're at 1 per month vs 30 per month, that's not zero but it's good. So next month you try to beat that, or stay at one drink per month. And in three monthes try to get a zero.
- projektfu 9y ago
  The Easy Way to Stop Drinking, by Allen Carr
  - KludgyPerl 9y ago
    This Naked Mind, by Annie Grace
- sn9 9y ago
  You should check out this 2015 article from The Atlantic for a discussion about what we know about evidence-based addiction interventions: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/ https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irr...
qrbLPHiKpiux 9y ago
Isn't this all about moderation? I mean, ethanol is a very simple molecule. Out bodies metabolize it quite well. Even too much sun exposure causes cancer. Really, everything causes cancer. Chronic inflammation and irritation can, too.
allpratik 9y ago
I always wanted to ask this question, Does it is really uncool if someone learns that I had never tasted an alcohol even once in my life, and never intend to do either? On personal level, I don't really like or have any reason or wish to drink it. Sometimes though, I read that alcohol is good for overall health in small quantities. While, I really doubt it, considering it's additive properties! Literally, among my friend circle everyone drinks for no reason. Most of the times, Just to be cool! Has alcohol become new norm of today's lifestyle across the world?
- wolco 9y ago
  It is good for your health in small doses like salt. But people like the affect and over do it to the point there are no health benefits.
  - theoh 9y ago
    Usual official advice is not to start drinking purely for sake of health benefits -- they are outweighed by risks at any level of consumption.
- sk5t 9y ago
  From your perspective they're drinking for no reason, but there probably is a reason, and that is to lower inhibitions or forget their troubles for a while.
- scottLobster 9y ago
  Alcohol is only addictive to alcoholics, and precisely what makes an alcoholic is a subject of ongoing research. Assuming you're not an alcoholic (the more likely option) it's no more addictive than candy. Actually less addictive, as candy doesn't have a hangover. As for drinking due to peer pressure, well drinking is a social thing. But in my experience most people will be perfectly fine with you not drinking for whatever reason. You might lose out though being the only sober one at the party, and you'll be driving a lot of people home if you have a car. :) For my part I'll typically go through a 6-pack or bottle of wine on the weekend, I never drink during the week. There are some very tasty alcoholic drinks out there, and while I find getting plastered unpleasant a mild-moderate buzz is quite enjoyable.
scottLobster 9y ago
That study's introduction is a little disingenuous and frankly a little alarmist. To break it down: Edit: Just to be clear, I'm not trying to disprove the study. I simply think their introduction is needlessly hyperbolic. "Alcohol consumption is a well-established risk factor for a range of cancers, accounting for approximately 4% of new cancer cases annually [1, 2]." The first citation is pay-walled, so I can't confirm, but the abstract states "The net effect of alcohol consumption on health is detrimental, with an estimated 3.8% of all global deaths and 4.6% of global disability-adjusted life-years attributable to alcohol." It says nothing about cancer specifically, but this could just be a vague abstract. Perhaps the data holds up, but a very large fraction of that 3.8% and 4.6% would have to be due to cancer. I'm skeptical. The second citation however is blatantly misrepresented. It appears to be where the 4% number comes from, but it is UK specific (and almost certainly influenced by UK-specific drinking habits). The authors by contrast present it in a general context. Likewise it's worth noting that the source puts quitting smoking, keeping a healthy weight, and eating more fruits/vegetables as more important in preventing cancer than reducing alcohol consumption. And even at UK levels it's apparently only marginally more important than reducing sun exposure (also a UK-specific result). They go on to effectively support the statement "alcohol increases cancer risk" in detail and I guess I can't blame them for wanting to grab the reader's attention, but scientific spin doctoring and lack of hard numbers irks me regardless of context. As for alcohol companies telling their customers as little as legally required about the negative effects of alcohol, I'm glad they put some numbers on the issue but I think we can file that in the "no shit" folder. The policy makers/lesson planners/etc they appear to aim the study at are almost certainly well aware of the concept of conflict-of-interest, and if they aren't then I doubt they're literate enough to be swayed by this study.
- mohawk 9y ago
  Go to Google Scholar and type in the paper's title - often there will be a link to a publically available copy of the pdf, such as is the case for reference 1. And you sound like you made up your mind before even really digging into the literature. Your first job as a scientist is to not fool yourself.
  - 9y ago
daveejones 9y ago
abstaining from alcohol linked to higher risk of death... https://health.spectator.co.uk/the-great-alcohol-cover-up-how-public-health-bodies-hid-the-truth-about-drinking/ https://health.spectator.co.uk/the-great-alcohol-cover-up-ho...
- taneq 9y ago
  Critically ill people, the kind that die a lot, generally don't drink a lot.

107 points by kawera 9y ago

chewyland 9y ago

Cancer or not, I really should stop drinking.

whistlerbrk 9y ago
Good luck, start exercising if you are not.
- agumonkey 9y ago
  Also never "stop", slow down, allow for pauses, allow for minute amounts, as long as you keep decreasing.
  - fergonco 9y ago
    In the case of an alcohol addiction, decrease of consumption is almost a guarantee to relapse.
    - hyperpape 9y ago
      While zero consumption is probably the best, the belief that it's all or nothing seems to be associated with severity of relapse/bingeing after a failure of self-control http://persweb.wabash.edu/facstaff/hortonr/articles%20for%20class/baumeister%20and%20heatherton.pdf http://persweb.wabash.edu/facstaff/hortonr/articles%20for%20...
  - pg314 9y ago
    I found it much easier to completely eliminate alcohol than to reduce my consumption. You no longer have to think about it, and you're no longer tempted by 'just one more drink' (which becomes even more tempting after a couple of drinks).
    - BartSaM 9y ago
      Everyone is different. I also prefer just stop, but not everyone has will power to do so.
    - agumonkey 9y ago
      I didn't mean to reduce as a goal, but to not hurt yourself emotionally if you ever skip a beat as long as its tiny. If you finally drink once after a month of being sober, you're at 1 per month vs 30 per month, that's not zero but it's good. So next month you try to beat that, or stay at one drink per month. And in three monthes try to get a zero.
projektfu 9y ago
The Easy Way to Stop Drinking, by Allen Carr
- KludgyPerl 9y ago
  This Naked Mind, by Annie Grace
sn9 9y ago
You should check out this 2015 article from The Atlantic for a discussion about what we know about evidence-based addiction interventions: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/ https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irr...

qrbLPHiKpiux 9y ago

Isn't this all about moderation? I mean, ethanol is a very simple molecule. Out bodies metabolize it quite well. Even too much sun exposure causes cancer. Really, everything causes cancer. Chronic inflammation and irritation can, too.

allpratik 9y ago

I always wanted to ask this question, Does it is really uncool if someone learns that I had never tasted an alcohol even once in my life, and never intend to do either? On personal level, I don't really like or have any reason or wish to drink it. Sometimes though, I read that alcohol is good for overall health in small quantities. While, I really doubt it, considering it's additive properties! Literally, among my friend circle everyone drinks for no reason. Most of the times, Just to be cool! Has alcohol become new norm of today's lifestyle across the world?

wolco 9y ago
It is good for your health in small doses like salt. But people like the affect and over do it to the point there are no health benefits.
- theoh 9y ago
  Usual official advice is not to start drinking purely for sake of health benefits -- they are outweighed by risks at any level of consumption.
sk5t 9y ago
From your perspective they're drinking for no reason, but there probably is a reason, and that is to lower inhibitions or forget their troubles for a while.
scottLobster 9y ago
Alcohol is only addictive to alcoholics, and precisely what makes an alcoholic is a subject of ongoing research. Assuming you're not an alcoholic (the more likely option) it's no more addictive than candy. Actually less addictive, as candy doesn't have a hangover. As for drinking due to peer pressure, well drinking is a social thing. But in my experience most people will be perfectly fine with you not drinking for whatever reason. You might lose out though being the only sober one at the party, and you'll be driving a lot of people home if you have a car. :) For my part I'll typically go through a 6-pack or bottle of wine on the weekend, I never drink during the week. There are some very tasty alcoholic drinks out there, and while I find getting plastered unpleasant a mild-moderate buzz is quite enjoyable.

scottLobster 9y ago

That study's introduction is a little disingenuous and frankly a little alarmist. To break it down: Edit: Just to be clear, I'm not trying to disprove the study. I simply think their introduction is needlessly hyperbolic. "Alcohol consumption is a well-established risk factor for a range of cancers, accounting for approximately 4% of new cancer cases annually [1, 2]." The first citation is pay-walled, so I can't confirm, but the abstract states "The net effect of alcohol consumption on health is detrimental, with an estimated 3.8% of all global deaths and 4.6% of global disability-adjusted life-years attributable to alcohol." It says nothing about cancer specifically, but this could just be a vague abstract. Perhaps the data holds up, but a very large fraction of that 3.8% and 4.6% would have to be due to cancer. I'm skeptical. The second citation however is blatantly misrepresented. It appears to be where the 4% number comes from, but it is UK specific (and almost certainly influenced by UK-specific drinking habits). The authors by contrast present it in a general context. Likewise it's worth noting that the source puts quitting smoking, keeping a healthy weight, and eating more fruits/vegetables as more important in preventing cancer than reducing alcohol consumption. And even at UK levels it's apparently only marginally more important than reducing sun exposure (also a UK-specific result). They go on to effectively support the statement "alcohol increases cancer risk" in detail and I guess I can't blame them for wanting to grab the reader's attention, but scientific spin doctoring and lack of hard numbers irks me regardless of context. As for alcohol companies telling their customers as little as legally required about the negative effects of alcohol, I'm glad they put some numbers on the issue but I think we can file that in the "no shit" folder. The policy makers/lesson planners/etc they appear to aim the study at are almost certainly well aware of the concept of conflict-of-interest, and if they aren't then I doubt they're literate enough to be swayed by this study.

mohawk 9y ago
Go to Google Scholar and type in the paper's title - often there will be a link to a publically available copy of the pdf, such as is the case for reference 1. And you sound like you made up your mind before even really digging into the literature. Your first job as a scientist is to not fool yourself.
- 9y ago

daveejones 9y ago

abstaining from alcohol linked to higher risk of death... https://health.spectator.co.uk/the-great-alcohol-cover-up-how-public-health-bodies-hid-the-truth-about-drinking/ https://health.spectator.co.uk/the-great-alcohol-cover-up-ho...

taneq 9y ago
Critically ill people, the kind that die a lot, generally don't drink a lot.