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R3 had an options contract to purchase 5 billion Ripples for $42,500,000 any time until 2019 Ripple doesn't like that the same purchase would give Ripple Inc.

R3 had an options contract to purchase 5 billion Ripples for $42,500,000 any time until 2019 Ripple doesn't like that the same purchase would give Ripple Inc. $1,000,000,000 at today's exchange rates Ripple doesn't know how options contracts work. ha ha oh well. I wonder if there is another side to the story. Otherwise, easy case!

mgberlin 9y ago
You missed a few zeroes in that billion.
- ringaroundthetx 9y ago
  thanks, fixed now
- rhaps0dy 9y ago
  Also, shouldn't it be "cause losses" rather than "give"? It is unlikely that a corporation doesn't like being given money.
s17n 9y ago
But would it be possible to sell even $42,500,000 of Ripple right now?
- olegkikin 9y ago
  Easily. That's less than the daily volume on just one exchange: https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/ripple/#markets https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/ripple/#markets Of course, you won't get a good deal if you just try and dump $42M worth of Ripple in one sale order. I'd spread it over a week over multiple exchanges. But note that it will actually be a billion dollars worth of Ripple, which is much much harder to sell.
  - s17n 9y ago
    Right, I was thinking more along the lines of needing to raise the $42 mil to exercise the option. Anyway, I'm really curious about what the relationship between trading volumes and how much money you can actually get is - it doesn't seem obvious to me. Like, if I'm a trader trying to make short term gains trading a million dollars a day, and I decide on a new strategy that involves doing 10 times more trades, the volume just went up by $9,000,000/day but the underlying demand for currency is still the same. I posted an ask HN about this at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15203974 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15203974
    - olegkikin 9y ago
      It depends which currency/ICO you're talking about. Trading $10M/day in bitcoin world is not a big deal. You can look at the market depth on various exchanges: http://bitcoinity.org/markets/bitstamp/USD http://bitcoinity.org/markets/bitstamp/USD For instance, if you dump $10M worth of bitcoin on Bitstamp, the price will shift by only $270, and that's ignoring the hidden limit orders. And the market will react to it as well - cheaper coins create more demand.
      - s17n 9y ago
        I'm not totally sure what the chart means (and I did read the explanation), but if I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying that Bitstamp has $10M worth of buy orders for BTC at a price of at least $(current price - 270)?
        modeless 9y ago
        Yes, that is what he means. You can see a combined order book for most of the large exchanges here: http://data.bitcoinity.org/markets/books/USD http://data.bitcoinity.org/markets/books/USD For example, by looking at this chart one can calculate that if one sold 10,000 Bitcoins right now with simultaneous market orders across all exchanges, one would receive north of $40M and the price would drop to $4,000.
- foota 9y ago
  That is not what the option is for. They're buying ~1 billion ripples for a fraction of what they cost.
  - s17n 9y ago
    I understand what an option is...
- csomar 9y ago
  $10million+ single transactions rarely happen on the orderbook. More like OTC. Bitfinex for example has an OTC window for large transactions. $50-100m+ transactions probably happen through dinners, multiple meetings, multiple negotiations, etc...
dangero 9y ago
Did you read the article? Ripple wanted out because there were other agreements in the partnership that Ripple claims R3 did not follow through on and they are countersuing for this reason.
- robot 9y ago
  how do you know those agreements have any ties with this one.
  - ng12 9y ago
    How do you know there's not? If there was only some sort of legally binding arbitration system we could find out.
    - fapjacks 9y ago
      The code is the contract! /s
    - guelo 9y ago
      The wording in the article is kind of vague "parallel technology partnership agreement". I have no idea if "parallel" means that the 2 contracts are connected or not. Maybe that's what the court is going to determine.
  - elevensies 9y ago
    A contract requires something to be exchanged, there is a minimum of one other thing that has to be connected to this. (I.e. payment for the option)
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
- ringaroundthetx 9y ago
  I read the article, my post was reading through it
thebird 9y ago
That is incredible. The market cap of XRP is almost 8 billion, and having so many coins with a competitor would most likely crush the currency. I'm having difficulty imagining why Ripple would ever give a R3 the option to purchase 5% of coins in circulation, business agreements aside.
- nosuchthing 9y ago
  The market cap of Ripple (and many of the premined coin/token supplies) is very misleading as often %70 or more of the total supply is in the hands of the founders or an anonymous presale/ICO "purchaser" i.e. Ripple co-founder owns ~9,000,000,000 Ripple units, and is selling them off en mass: https://www.coindesk.com/ripple-jed-mccaleb-settle-suit-over-1-million-in-disputed-funds/ https://www.coindesk.com/ripple-jed-mccaleb-settle-suit-over...
  - peterarmstrong 9y ago
    masse :)
  - Temasik 9y ago
    But still the public view EOS year long token distribution as a scam No other business model to distribute tokens besides wasteful mining

mgberlin 9y ago

You missed a few zeroes in that billion.

ringaroundthetx 9y ago
thanks, fixed now
rhaps0dy 9y ago
Also, shouldn't it be "cause losses" rather than "give"? It is unlikely that a corporation doesn't like being given money.

s17n 9y ago

But would it be possible to sell even $42,500,000 of Ripple right now?

olegkikin 9y ago
Easily. That's less than the daily volume on just one exchange: https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/ripple/#markets https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/ripple/#markets Of course, you won't get a good deal if you just try and dump $42M worth of Ripple in one sale order. I'd spread it over a week over multiple exchanges. But note that it will actually be a billion dollars worth of Ripple, which is much much harder to sell.
- s17n 9y ago
  Right, I was thinking more along the lines of needing to raise the $42 mil to exercise the option. Anyway, I'm really curious about what the relationship between trading volumes and how much money you can actually get is - it doesn't seem obvious to me. Like, if I'm a trader trying to make short term gains trading a million dollars a day, and I decide on a new strategy that involves doing 10 times more trades, the volume just went up by $9,000,000/day but the underlying demand for currency is still the same. I posted an ask HN about this at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15203974 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15203974
  - olegkikin 9y ago
    It depends which currency/ICO you're talking about. Trading $10M/day in bitcoin world is not a big deal. You can look at the market depth on various exchanges: http://bitcoinity.org/markets/bitstamp/USD http://bitcoinity.org/markets/bitstamp/USD For instance, if you dump $10M worth of bitcoin on Bitstamp, the price will shift by only $270, and that's ignoring the hidden limit orders. And the market will react to it as well - cheaper coins create more demand.
    - s17n 9y ago
      I'm not totally sure what the chart means (and I did read the explanation), but if I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying that Bitstamp has $10M worth of buy orders for BTC at a price of at least $(current price - 270)?
      - modeless 9y ago
        Yes, that is what he means. You can see a combined order book for most of the large exchanges here: http://data.bitcoinity.org/markets/books/USD http://data.bitcoinity.org/markets/books/USD For example, by looking at this chart one can calculate that if one sold 10,000 Bitcoins right now with simultaneous market orders across all exchanges, one would receive north of $40M and the price would drop to $4,000.
foota 9y ago
That is not what the option is for. They're buying ~1 billion ripples for a fraction of what they cost.
- s17n 9y ago
  I understand what an option is...
csomar 9y ago
$10million+ single transactions rarely happen on the orderbook. More like OTC. Bitfinex for example has an OTC window for large transactions. $50-100m+ transactions probably happen through dinners, multiple meetings, multiple negotiations, etc...

dangero 9y ago

Did you read the article? Ripple wanted out because there were other agreements in the partnership that Ripple claims R3 did not follow through on and they are countersuing for this reason.

robot 9y ago
how do you know those agreements have any ties with this one.
- ng12 9y ago
  How do you know there's not? If there was only some sort of legally binding arbitration system we could find out.
  - fapjacks 9y ago
    The code is the contract! /s
  - guelo 9y ago
    The wording in the article is kind of vague "parallel technology partnership agreement". I have no idea if "parallel" means that the 2 contracts are connected or not. Maybe that's what the court is going to determine.
- elevensies 9y ago
  A contract requires something to be exchanged, there is a minimum of one other thing that has to be connected to this. (I.e. payment for the option)
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
ringaroundthetx 9y ago
I read the article, my post was reading through it

thebird 9y ago

That is incredible. The market cap of XRP is almost 8 billion, and having so many coins with a competitor would most likely crush the currency. I'm having difficulty imagining why Ripple would ever give a R3 the option to purchase 5% of coins in circulation, business agreements aside.

nosuchthing 9y ago
The market cap of Ripple (and many of the premined coin/token supplies) is very misleading as often %70 or more of the total supply is in the hands of the founders or an anonymous presale/ICO "purchaser" i.e. Ripple co-founder owns ~9,000,000,000 Ripple units, and is selling them off en mass: https://www.coindesk.com/ripple-jed-mccaleb-settle-suit-over-1-million-in-disputed-funds/ https://www.coindesk.com/ripple-jed-mccaleb-settle-suit-over...
- peterarmstrong 9y ago
  masse :)
- Temasik 9y ago
  But still the public view EOS year long token distribution as a scam No other business model to distribute tokens besides wasteful mining