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> Even the ones who do have their identities stolen will likely be made whole by the credit card companies. Are credit card companies now in the habit of reimb

> Even the ones who do have their identities stolen will likely be made whole by the credit card companies. Are credit card companies now in the habit of reimbursing consumers for the considerable time and headache required to sort out fraudulent charges caused by insecure data storage practices in the credit reporting agencies that the credit card companies contract with? There are numerous reports of identity fraud causing a significant amount of trouble for the consumers involved, and as far as I know, not a one of them has ever received a letter beginning, "We're sorry for the time and trouble you went through to clear this up", with an attached check.

jlarocco 9y ago
> Are credit card companies now in the habit of reimbursing consumers for the considerable time and headache required to sort out fraudulent charges caused by insecure data storage practices in the credit reporting agencies that the credit card companies contract with? It's not a "habit", it's the law. It doesn't matter how the fraudulent charges came to be. If a person disputes a charge and has evidence to show it's fraudulent, then by law the credit card company has to investigate, and deal with it. It also makes business sense. CC companies make a ton of money with legal transactions, and an anti-consumer, pro-fraud reputation would cost them customers. > There are numerous reports of identity fraud causing a significant amount of trouble for the consumers involved, and as far as I know, not a one of them has ever received a letter beginning, "We're sorry for the time and trouble you went through to clear this up", with an attached check. Why would the bank or credit card company send a check? Presumably they're not the one who committed the crime, so why should they cover the damages? I've had my identity stolen, and it was a PITA to clear up, but the bank and credit companies were reasonable about it, IMO. In a case like this, where it's easy to point at the Equifax breach and say, "See? This is how they got my info.", it's probably even easier to clear up, though I'm sure it's still a hassle.
- jldugger 9y ago
  > It's not a "habit", it's the law. It doesn't matter how the fraudulent charges came to be. If a person disputes a charge and has evidence to prove they didn't make it, then by law the credit card company has to investigate, and deal with it. But the time it takes on the phone to talk to an agent, review your records for legit vs illegit charges, etc. are not reimbursed, which is what they were on about. > Why would the bank or credit card company send a check? I think we're talking Target writing the check. Which they didn't exactly volunteer to do, but was covered in the class action at least: https://targetbreachsettlement.com/mainpage/CommonlyAskedQuestions.aspx#a-7 https://targetbreachsettlement.com/mainpage/CommonlyAskedQue...
- KGIII 9y ago
  Time. I'm pretty old, retired, and have a few bucks. Time is my most precious commodity, and I prefer to give it to those who deserve it. I'm not sure how much I'd want someone to pay me for an hour of my time. Clearing up identity theft can take many hours. Those are hours I can spend bugging the missus, or even bugging you folks. I am clearly not to blame for their data exfiltration. Who is going to pay me for my time? What is my time worth to them? This is all theoretical. My credit has been frozen for a long time. It has been that way since the OPM hack. However, for the sake of expression, I point out that my time is pretty valuable to me. Those who steal my time are worse than those who would steal my property. I can insure my property, I can not replace my time.
  - agrue 9y ago
    This has been hitting me hard lately. I'm pretty young at the tail end of my 20s, job is finally stable enough not to worry about money, and have really started to realize how few free hours I can find in a week. Work and its on call rotation, obligations to the girlfriend and social circles, maintenance on the house and cars, bills that don't have an auto pay option. Last month my auto registration sticker didn't show up in the mail after renewing it. A trip to the county clerk, then the sheriff's office to file a report, then back to the clerk to get another sticker took almost two hours. Stopping by the local bank to change my address after the online system locked my account for two incorrect password attempts took 90 minutes. 6 phone calls after a cancelled auto insurance policy made an auto draft the next month. My coworker has a pile of kids, two with medical issues, it seems like his wife has a part time job dealing with medical billing issues. Most of these rambling examples aren't the fault of the organizing institution (unlike the Equifax leak at hand), but in the end individuals are bound by those institutions' organizational practices in their pursuit of normalcy. I don't know how it could be implemented or enforced, but at a certain point it feels like individuals should be compensated for suffering organizational incompetence or negligence.
    - KGIII 9y ago
      I got lucky and sold my business when I was just 49. However, I worked a minimum of 60 hours per week, for years. Which gets me to my response: Cherish that time. I don't care about longevity, I care about maximum value. I may be content to die today, but I'm not content wasting time on something that is forced on me. I don't regret much, but I do regret my time that was wasted by others. As I look back, I see do many situations where I could have disallowed that while still getting the same eventual outcome.
lr4444lr 9y ago
What headache? Get with Capital One, Chase, Citi, or one of the other big names. They are very professional about replacement cards and zero hassle.
- flerchin 9y ago
  Replacement credit cards are not the issue. Whoever has this data has the complete dataset to open new credit cards in your name, buy a car in your name, get plastic surgery in your name, etc. The hassle will be convincing all those companies that you do not in fact owe them thousands, and there is no automatic protections for these types of harms.
  - badwolf 9y ago
    Even worse, is if you don't immediately notice a new account on your credit report, that then goes to collections. -_- 10 years later and I still get threatening calls from the shadiest of shady "collection agencies"
    - throwaway613834 9y ago
      Do you know if there's any way to "notice" these new accounts without having to freeze your credit or otherwise mess with the normal process for getting new credit? I just want a notification, nothing else.
      - IgorPartola 9y ago
        Credit Karma seems to do that OK. Their score is wildly different from their supposed source though.
        throwaway613834 9y ago
        Oh yeah I don't need the scores, I just want notifications for new accounts. Cool, thanks! I'll check it out.
    - 9y ago

jlarocco 9y ago

> Are credit card companies now in the habit of reimbursing consumers for the considerable time and headache required to sort out fraudulent charges caused by insecure data storage practices in the credit reporting agencies that the credit card companies contract with? It's not a "habit", it's the law. It doesn't matter how the fraudulent charges came to be. If a person disputes a charge and has evidence to show it's fraudulent, then by law the credit card company has to investigate, and deal with it. It also makes business sense. CC companies make a ton of money with legal transactions, and an anti-consumer, pro-fraud reputation would cost them customers. > There are numerous reports of identity fraud causing a significant amount of trouble for the consumers involved, and as far as I know, not a one of them has ever received a letter beginning, "We're sorry for the time and trouble you went through to clear this up", with an attached check. Why would the bank or credit card company send a check? Presumably they're not the one who committed the crime, so why should they cover the damages? I've had my identity stolen, and it was a PITA to clear up, but the bank and credit companies were reasonable about it, IMO. In a case like this, where it's easy to point at the Equifax breach and say, "See? This is how they got my info.", it's probably even easier to clear up, though I'm sure it's still a hassle.

jldugger 9y ago
> It's not a "habit", it's the law. It doesn't matter how the fraudulent charges came to be. If a person disputes a charge and has evidence to prove they didn't make it, then by law the credit card company has to investigate, and deal with it. But the time it takes on the phone to talk to an agent, review your records for legit vs illegit charges, etc. are not reimbursed, which is what they were on about. > Why would the bank or credit card company send a check? I think we're talking Target writing the check. Which they didn't exactly volunteer to do, but was covered in the class action at least: https://targetbreachsettlement.com/mainpage/CommonlyAskedQuestions.aspx#a-7 https://targetbreachsettlement.com/mainpage/CommonlyAskedQue...
KGIII 9y ago
Time. I'm pretty old, retired, and have a few bucks. Time is my most precious commodity, and I prefer to give it to those who deserve it. I'm not sure how much I'd want someone to pay me for an hour of my time. Clearing up identity theft can take many hours. Those are hours I can spend bugging the missus, or even bugging you folks. I am clearly not to blame for their data exfiltration. Who is going to pay me for my time? What is my time worth to them? This is all theoretical. My credit has been frozen for a long time. It has been that way since the OPM hack. However, for the sake of expression, I point out that my time is pretty valuable to me. Those who steal my time are worse than those who would steal my property. I can insure my property, I can not replace my time.
- agrue 9y ago
  This has been hitting me hard lately. I'm pretty young at the tail end of my 20s, job is finally stable enough not to worry about money, and have really started to realize how few free hours I can find in a week. Work and its on call rotation, obligations to the girlfriend and social circles, maintenance on the house and cars, bills that don't have an auto pay option. Last month my auto registration sticker didn't show up in the mail after renewing it. A trip to the county clerk, then the sheriff's office to file a report, then back to the clerk to get another sticker took almost two hours. Stopping by the local bank to change my address after the online system locked my account for two incorrect password attempts took 90 minutes. 6 phone calls after a cancelled auto insurance policy made an auto draft the next month. My coworker has a pile of kids, two with medical issues, it seems like his wife has a part time job dealing with medical billing issues. Most of these rambling examples aren't the fault of the organizing institution (unlike the Equifax leak at hand), but in the end individuals are bound by those institutions' organizational practices in their pursuit of normalcy. I don't know how it could be implemented or enforced, but at a certain point it feels like individuals should be compensated for suffering organizational incompetence or negligence.
  - KGIII 9y ago
    I got lucky and sold my business when I was just 49. However, I worked a minimum of 60 hours per week, for years. Which gets me to my response: Cherish that time. I don't care about longevity, I care about maximum value. I may be content to die today, but I'm not content wasting time on something that is forced on me. I don't regret much, but I do regret my time that was wasted by others. As I look back, I see do many situations where I could have disallowed that while still getting the same eventual outcome.

lr4444lr 9y ago

What headache? Get with Capital One, Chase, Citi, or one of the other big names. They are very professional about replacement cards and zero hassle.

flerchin 9y ago
Replacement credit cards are not the issue. Whoever has this data has the complete dataset to open new credit cards in your name, buy a car in your name, get plastic surgery in your name, etc. The hassle will be convincing all those companies that you do not in fact owe them thousands, and there is no automatic protections for these types of harms.
- badwolf 9y ago
  Even worse, is if you don't immediately notice a new account on your credit report, that then goes to collections. -_- 10 years later and I still get threatening calls from the shadiest of shady "collection agencies"
  - throwaway613834 9y ago
    Do you know if there's any way to "notice" these new accounts without having to freeze your credit or otherwise mess with the normal process for getting new credit? I just want a notification, nothing else.
    - IgorPartola 9y ago
      Credit Karma seems to do that OK. Their score is wildly different from their supposed source though.
      - throwaway613834 9y ago
        Oh yeah I don't need the scores, I just want notifications for new accounts. Cool, thanks! I'll check it out.
  - 9y ago