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I'm assuming you wrote this comment as a C programmer (or have used C in a professional setting?) If so - how did you get into that? I'm really looking to _bu

by kzisme 9y ago

I'm assuming you wrote this comment as a C programmer (or have used C in a professional setting?) If so - how did you get into that? I'm really looking to _build_ something rather than just going through a book or tutorial (although they have a place and time). ' I suppose my objectives are learning as much as I can, and (ideally) having a day job working with that technology. All of this is more or less driven by interest and enjoyment of programming.

ryl00 9y ago
> I'm really looking to _build_ something rather than just going through a book or tutorial (although they have a place and time). ' It might be worthwhile to start 'small' by taking one of your C# projects and converting some small section into a native/unmanaged C or C++ DLL that gets used by the C# side. There's a lot of boilerplate involved setting things up on both sides of the divide, but you can stay in a mostly familiar environment yet start learning about some of the 'magic' C# handles for you that is exposed by the unmanaged code, and extend your experimental forays into the C side as you get more comfortable.
hzhou321 9y ago
It will be a frustrating experience to learn C with a mindset of career. The mindset of career is about results, C is often not a shortcut to most superficial (visible) results. (It is a shortcut to real programming skill though, but a real skill without paper career record doesn't mean much for your career.) But if you can afford a hobby and have the luxury of certain time at disposal, then I would suggest you to approach C as if you are picking up a leisure book. You learn more and enjoys more that way. You only need a day or two with a book or tutorial. Then you should simply start solving simple problems. If your math is OK, I would suggest project Euler. Programming is mostly common sense, you learn through practicing. Without the career mindset, you are very likely to enjoy the practice. Now assume you acquired your career some other way (Java for example) and now you gained certain freedom in your job, and with the unique experence from C, you can try make decisions based on your understanding and common sense. I choose C in my work only because I have that freedom (but that freedom was not gained via C).
- kzisme 9y ago
  Thanks for your interesting perspective :) I always think of people who use C professionally as people who have been doing it for a _very_ long time and know a lot about it. In that situation it would be exceptionally hard to find any employment working with C. I've always been hesitant at many Project Euler problems since some of the math is off putting to me. That's why I consider building something (like a side project or something of use). Using C as a learning tool to better understand programming would be a great idea and I'll likely venture into that- hopefully something comes of it though! :)
  - hzhou321 9y ago
    >> I've always been hesitant at many Project Euler problems since some of the math is off putting to me. That's why I consider building something (like a side project or something of use). Math has the nature of simplicity -- well defined and little complication, but abstract (or useless). If you like building things, I would suggest a text editor or a GUI layout engine. For the latter, think about an intuitive declarative way of describing layout (like HTML/CSS or TeX or Tk) then implement it on native win32 API or GTK. Focus on the simplicity and in-control aspect; do not get distracted by feature completeness.
    - kzisme 9y ago
      > If you like building things, I would suggest a text editor or a GUI layout engine. For the latter, think about an intuitive declarative way of describing layout (like HTML/CSS or TeX or Tk) then implement it on native win32 API or GTK. Focus on the simplicity and in-control aspect; do not get distracted by feature completeness. Both of these sound like great learning projects - but are they too far in the "deep end" for a beginner? Just curious :)
      - sjmulder 9y ago
        I wish there was a more modern version of Programming Windows by Charles Petzold that I could recommend for its great, down to Earth introduction to Win32, but unfortunately the fifth edition from 1998 was the last of its kind. If you're OK with the dated context it's still applicable to modern Win32. You can find it used.

by kzisme 9y ago

ryl00 9y ago

> I'm really looking to _build_ something rather than just going through a book or tutorial (although they have a place and time). ' It might be worthwhile to start 'small' by taking one of your C# projects and converting some small section into a native/unmanaged C or C++ DLL that gets used by the C# side. There's a lot of boilerplate involved setting things up on both sides of the divide, but you can stay in a mostly familiar environment yet start learning about some of the 'magic' C# handles for you that is exposed by the unmanaged code, and extend your experimental forays into the C side as you get more comfortable.

hzhou321 9y ago

It will be a frustrating experience to learn C with a mindset of career. The mindset of career is about results, C is often not a shortcut to most superficial (visible) results. (It is a shortcut to real programming skill though, but a real skill without paper career record doesn't mean much for your career.) But if you can afford a hobby and have the luxury of certain time at disposal, then I would suggest you to approach C as if you are picking up a leisure book. You learn more and enjoys more that way. You only need a day or two with a book or tutorial. Then you should simply start solving simple problems. If your math is OK, I would suggest project Euler. Programming is mostly common sense, you learn through practicing. Without the career mindset, you are very likely to enjoy the practice. Now assume you acquired your career some other way (Java for example) and now you gained certain freedom in your job, and with the unique experence from C, you can try make decisions based on your understanding and common sense. I choose C in my work only because I have that freedom (but that freedom was not gained via C).

kzisme 9y ago
Thanks for your interesting perspective :) I always think of people who use C professionally as people who have been doing it for a _very_ long time and know a lot about it. In that situation it would be exceptionally hard to find any employment working with C. I've always been hesitant at many Project Euler problems since some of the math is off putting to me. That's why I consider building something (like a side project or something of use). Using C as a learning tool to better understand programming would be a great idea and I'll likely venture into that- hopefully something comes of it though! :)
- hzhou321 9y ago
  >> I've always been hesitant at many Project Euler problems since some of the math is off putting to me. That's why I consider building something (like a side project or something of use). Math has the nature of simplicity -- well defined and little complication, but abstract (or useless). If you like building things, I would suggest a text editor or a GUI layout engine. For the latter, think about an intuitive declarative way of describing layout (like HTML/CSS or TeX or Tk) then implement it on native win32 API or GTK. Focus on the simplicity and in-control aspect; do not get distracted by feature completeness.
  - kzisme 9y ago
    > If you like building things, I would suggest a text editor or a GUI layout engine. For the latter, think about an intuitive declarative way of describing layout (like HTML/CSS or TeX or Tk) then implement it on native win32 API or GTK. Focus on the simplicity and in-control aspect; do not get distracted by feature completeness. Both of these sound like great learning projects - but are they too far in the "deep end" for a beginner? Just curious :)
    - sjmulder 9y ago
      I wish there was a more modern version of Programming Windows by Charles Petzold that I could recommend for its great, down to Earth introduction to Win32, but unfortunately the fifth edition from 1998 was the last of its kind. If you're OK with the dated context it's still applicable to modern Win32. You can find it used.