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Wow. Having an ID card seems so normal to me that I would never have thought that the US didn't have any. I've been to the US before and never even noticed. Tha

Wow. Having an ID card seems so normal to me that I would never have thought that the US didn't have any. I've been to the US before and never even noticed. Thanks for the link.

mikeash 9y ago
There's a substantial faction of the American right wing which is vehemently opposed to any sort of national ID scheme. They don't want the government having a big database of all citizens. Strangely, these tend to be the same people who want to require photo ID to vote.
- talmand 9y ago
  I believe the majority of these people would be against the Federal government requiring such an ID. They are likely fine with their local government, that they have more control over, handling such IDs which would be required for voting. But, of course, there's not much preventing the local government from sharing the info with the Feds.
- gok 9y ago
  I hate to play the recently poisoned "both sides" argument, but it really is weirdly widely unpopular. The ACLU in particular is strongly opposed to a national ID system. I say this as someone who would strongly support a federal mandatory national ID system (and the ACLU, generally)
  - mikeash 9y ago
    In this particular case, I think the "both sides" argument may well have merit. Thanks for pointing that out. I really should just say a big chunk of Americans.
- 794CD01 9y ago
  No, some of us would love for the government to have one in an ideal world, we just recognize that the US government that exists today is not competent enough to be trusted to run such a database. Just think about the topic we're discussing - do you really trust the US Department of Identity to not have breaches like this every year? The only difference is that we'd never hear about them.
  - mikeash 9y ago
    Is there any reason the data in a national database would have to be confidential in the first place?
  - neuromantik8086 9y ago
    One can dream that the state governments would be competent enough though. I feel like it wouldn't be that hard to make driver's licenses / state identification cards mandatory at the state level (fewer people to piss off).
- mikestew 9y ago
  There's a substantial faction of the American right wing which is vehemently opposed to any sort of national ID scheme. Oh, I doubt it's a left-right thing. I'm pretty lefty these days, and I oppose a national ID. Some minority groups, like say Jewish folks, might carry bad connotations about putting everybody in a big database so we can keep track of (and categorize) them.
- gnaritas 9y ago
  This is not a right wing issue, it's an authoritarian vs libertarian issue. Plenty of people on every side don't trust the government and don't want to give it more power.
rconti 9y ago
To be fair, I've traveled many places that require national ID cards, and yet never carried my passport on my person, in violation of local laws. And I've never had an issue. It's something so unlikely to come up in day-to-day interactions that it's not really that important. I'm sure if I got stopped in, say, France, and had no passport to show, they wouldn't exactly lock me up on the spot, they'd find a way to accommodate me. I still only have a really vague understanding of what happens if a cop in the US wants me to identify myself and I refuse. If I'm not suspected of a crime, obviously, I can just walk away. I'm not really sure what I'd do if I was arrested for cause and refused to identify myself.

Wow. Having an ID card seems so normal to me that I would never have thought that the US didn't have any. I've been to the US before and never even noticed. Thanks for the link.

mikeash 9y ago

There's a substantial faction of the American right wing which is vehemently opposed to any sort of national ID scheme. They don't want the government having a big database of all citizens. Strangely, these tend to be the same people who want to require photo ID to vote.

talmand 9y ago
I believe the majority of these people would be against the Federal government requiring such an ID. They are likely fine with their local government, that they have more control over, handling such IDs which would be required for voting. But, of course, there's not much preventing the local government from sharing the info with the Feds.
gok 9y ago
I hate to play the recently poisoned "both sides" argument, but it really is weirdly widely unpopular. The ACLU in particular is strongly opposed to a national ID system. I say this as someone who would strongly support a federal mandatory national ID system (and the ACLU, generally)
- mikeash 9y ago
  In this particular case, I think the "both sides" argument may well have merit. Thanks for pointing that out. I really should just say a big chunk of Americans.
794CD01 9y ago
No, some of us would love for the government to have one in an ideal world, we just recognize that the US government that exists today is not competent enough to be trusted to run such a database. Just think about the topic we're discussing - do you really trust the US Department of Identity to not have breaches like this every year? The only difference is that we'd never hear about them.
- mikeash 9y ago
  Is there any reason the data in a national database would have to be confidential in the first place?
- neuromantik8086 9y ago
  One can dream that the state governments would be competent enough though. I feel like it wouldn't be that hard to make driver's licenses / state identification cards mandatory at the state level (fewer people to piss off).
mikestew 9y ago
There's a substantial faction of the American right wing which is vehemently opposed to any sort of national ID scheme. Oh, I doubt it's a left-right thing. I'm pretty lefty these days, and I oppose a national ID. Some minority groups, like say Jewish folks, might carry bad connotations about putting everybody in a big database so we can keep track of (and categorize) them.
gnaritas 9y ago
This is not a right wing issue, it's an authoritarian vs libertarian issue. Plenty of people on every side don't trust the government and don't want to give it more power.

rconti 9y ago

To be fair, I've traveled many places that require national ID cards, and yet never carried my passport on my person, in violation of local laws. And I've never had an issue. It's something so unlikely to come up in day-to-day interactions that it's not really that important. I'm sure if I got stopped in, say, France, and had no passport to show, they wouldn't exactly lock me up on the spot, they'd find a way to accommodate me. I still only have a really vague understanding of what happens if a cop in the US wants me to identify myself and I refuse. If I'm not suspected of a crime, obviously, I can just walk away. I'm not really sure what I'd do if I was arrested for cause and refused to identify myself.