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Psychedelics are also called entheogens ("generator of the divine within"), because one common trait of a psychedelic 'trip' is experiencing the nature of the d

Psychedelics are also called entheogens ("generator of the divine within"), because one common trait of a psychedelic 'trip' is experiencing the nature of the divine, but also the divinity of 'life' in all living things when 'tripping'. The realization that plants, animals, water, air, are all part of one whole living system of which we're just cells, just like the cells within us, ... In other words, the realization of the divinity of nature. Most people tend to treat divinity with respect hence the link. I personally think everyone should have at least one psychedelic experience, especially in this age that we're in right now.

simplemts 9y ago
Beautifully worded and said.
kaffeemitsahne 9y ago
I think it would be more constructive to base environmentalism on rational arguments (of which there are many), rather than chemically flipping some switches in the brain to make everyone love nature.
- sova 9y ago
  Most people understand the world emotionally. Although rational and logical analysis can lead one to the same understanding, the freedom of mind is a hard sell, whereas "here try this snack" is far more accessible for most. Expedient means come in many forms and fashions. In a world of so many narratives and rationalities, being able to open up somebody's emotional understanding to greater senses and truths is something absolutely wonderful.
  - kaffeemitsahne 9y ago
    Sounds rather like brainwashing honestly. Even if it's for a good cause I'm not entirely comfortable with that.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - sova 9y ago
      There's no guarantee of results, it's just another way to introduce people to non-ordinary states of consciousness/mind. Certainly don't ever do it without someone's consent, and don't impose some sort of belief structure over what's personally and independently cognizable and knowable. I suppose I have a hard time saying that un-erasable insights are "brainwashing" because that's like saying traveling abroad is like being a traitor. Really, it makes you a stronger citizen, because then you have terms and modes with which to compare, and you also have a newfound wealth of treasure and discovery to help accelerate your own nation, to bring the simile full circle.
- colecut 9y ago
  There may be people who aren't concerned with rational arguments / are close minded / fixed in their own beliefs, who then have an experience that rattles their perception, and shows them that their perception is only that - perception. And how loose/fragile perception is. And often they will pause and question things a little more, think for themselves a little more. And this is usually for the better and will open them up to more rational points. That said, despite my fondness for these experiences, I do personally know 2 people who experienced prolonged (1-2 weeks) psychotic episodes after taking LSD. So there is more risk associated than many believe or want to accept. I haven't heard of this happening with mushrooms.
  - 3pt14159 9y ago
    Could you expand what that was like for them? I've always heard that LSD was one of the safest drugs out there, aside from false beliefs like thinking you can fly.
    - dsnuh 9y ago
      I hope GP doesn't take this the wrong way, as I am sure their friends may have had truly terrible experiences. It's not a myth, but it is also something that has been overly demonized. No, LSD doesn't make you think you can fly. That's after school special propaganda. That said, don't accept third hand reports of psychedelic experiences. If you want to read first hand accounts, I recommend browsing the trip reports at https://www.erowid.org/ https://www.erowid.org/. Or better yet, just give it a try and see for yourself. :)
      - colecut 9y ago
        I am not at all trying to demonize it. I guess I stated it in the way I did because, most enthusiasts start thinking that LSD is "the answer" or "the cure" etc etc.. and get super 'bout it and consequently tend to reject the idea of any real negative consequences, because the experience really is truly amazing and even the day after can be even more amazing, in stark contrast of the 'hangover'. So I just wanted to mention in spite of this, weird things do happen in very rare cases, and this could even be due to the fact that it's illegal and thus not manufactured with consistent/optimum purity. Both of my friends were quite experienced with dozens of enjoyable trips under their belt.
- meri_dian 9y ago
  Agreed. We should preserve the natural world if there are good reasons for doing so. I believe there are, not only for self preservation of the human species, but because of the joy so many feel being immersed in nature. Appeals to reason don't force us to bow to economic imperatives. Wanting to preserve nature for the joy it brings us is perfectly rational and reasonable.
- ux4 9y ago
  I think there are strong emotional anchors to environmentalism and all other political beliefs. You could provide a non-environmentalist with all the facts and rational arguments of why environmentalism is important, but you may never change their mind because they grew up a certain way and their belief on environmentalism is emotionally embedded. However, if they experienced the issue first hand or encountered some sort of emotionally-provoking insight (such as a psychedelic trip), they are more likely to reevaluate and change their core beliefs.
roceasta 9y ago
>one whole living system of which we're just cells It's a moving metaphor but of course cells within us have the same genome whereas different humans have different genomes. So it's hard to consider them part of one living system, unless one accepts the Gaia Hypothesis. The sense of oneness or of a divine essence permeating the whole of physical reality is caused by the fact that we don't perceive external entities directly. Rather we each of us perceive our own unified model of reality comprised of tokens for all entities including tokens representing external physical objects. And we may eventually become aware of this, giving rise to that sense. For some people this happens with the assistance of a hallucinogen which I think distorts the model enough for it to become noticeable as a model. Others have spontaneous spiritual experiences. None of which is to say that life isn't precious, or that consciousness is not a wonderful thing.
- sapote 9y ago
  > It's a moving metaphor but of course cells within us have the same genome whereas different humans have different genomes. So it's hard to consider them part of one living system, unless one accepts the Gaia Hypothesis. Except recent studies have found that even our own cells often have different DNA from each other (not just due to mutation), and that what makes us function is a careful dance of countless microbes.
- mej10 9y ago
  > So it's hard to consider them part of one living system You couldn't live without many other organisms both in you and around you.
  - roceasta 9y ago
    That's true; there's cooperation everywhere and at every level. But there's competition too. There are of course many organisms that kill and maim others to make a living. So the divine unity that the mystics, poets and psychonauts speak of cannot derive from nature per se, as many people believe. In my comment I tried to give an alternate explanation.
dsnuh 9y ago
A little background - LSD was my first drug. I started when I was 13, before I ever had a drink of liquor, or a puff from a cigarette. I tripped probably 75 times between the ages of 13-23. I firmly believe the same. Every person (without known psychological conditions) should have a psychedelic experience at least once within their lifetime, ideally during the formative years of early adulthood. These are tools to investigate what it means to be a consciousness here on Earth. They allow people that otherwise may not (I am a staunch Atheist, for example) to experience the ineffable. That changes you, and in my experience, usually for the better. It shows you that you are just a tiny part of the system, and that you have this rare and special gift of existing as a conscious being, able to investigate your own mind and perceptions of reality. It shows you that there is no "outside" yourself. I do think that most people would do better to try psilocybin, as it has a more "earthy" connected-ness feel to it than LSD ever did for me. To me, LSD puts you into the place of an alien experience this planet for the first time, and psilocybin makes you feel at home in your place in the world. LSD is much more cerebral, while psilocybin is more about the connected-ness. Either are recommended for use at Disneyland, if you want to get the full experience of just how weird and wonderful this reality is. ;) edit: Try psilocybin _first_, then LSD if you enjoyed that. Psilocybin doesn't last nearly as long as an LSD experience, which can be easier in my experience than just jumping straight into the deep end of the pool.

simplemts 9y ago

Beautifully worded and said.

kaffeemitsahne 9y ago

I think it would be more constructive to base environmentalism on rational arguments (of which there are many), rather than chemically flipping some switches in the brain to make everyone love nature.

sova 9y ago
Most people understand the world emotionally. Although rational and logical analysis can lead one to the same understanding, the freedom of mind is a hard sell, whereas "here try this snack" is far more accessible for most. Expedient means come in many forms and fashions. In a world of so many narratives and rationalities, being able to open up somebody's emotional understanding to greater senses and truths is something absolutely wonderful.
- kaffeemitsahne 9y ago
  Sounds rather like brainwashing honestly. Even if it's for a good cause I'm not entirely comfortable with that.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - sova 9y ago
    There's no guarantee of results, it's just another way to introduce people to non-ordinary states of consciousness/mind. Certainly don't ever do it without someone's consent, and don't impose some sort of belief structure over what's personally and independently cognizable and knowable. I suppose I have a hard time saying that un-erasable insights are "brainwashing" because that's like saying traveling abroad is like being a traitor. Really, it makes you a stronger citizen, because then you have terms and modes with which to compare, and you also have a newfound wealth of treasure and discovery to help accelerate your own nation, to bring the simile full circle.
colecut 9y ago
There may be people who aren't concerned with rational arguments / are close minded / fixed in their own beliefs, who then have an experience that rattles their perception, and shows them that their perception is only that - perception. And how loose/fragile perception is. And often they will pause and question things a little more, think for themselves a little more. And this is usually for the better and will open them up to more rational points. That said, despite my fondness for these experiences, I do personally know 2 people who experienced prolonged (1-2 weeks) psychotic episodes after taking LSD. So there is more risk associated than many believe or want to accept. I haven't heard of this happening with mushrooms.
- 3pt14159 9y ago
  Could you expand what that was like for them? I've always heard that LSD was one of the safest drugs out there, aside from false beliefs like thinking you can fly.
  - dsnuh 9y ago
    I hope GP doesn't take this the wrong way, as I am sure their friends may have had truly terrible experiences. It's not a myth, but it is also something that has been overly demonized. No, LSD doesn't make you think you can fly. That's after school special propaganda. That said, don't accept third hand reports of psychedelic experiences. If you want to read first hand accounts, I recommend browsing the trip reports at https://www.erowid.org/ https://www.erowid.org/. Or better yet, just give it a try and see for yourself. :)
    - colecut 9y ago
      I am not at all trying to demonize it. I guess I stated it in the way I did because, most enthusiasts start thinking that LSD is "the answer" or "the cure" etc etc.. and get super 'bout it and consequently tend to reject the idea of any real negative consequences, because the experience really is truly amazing and even the day after can be even more amazing, in stark contrast of the 'hangover'. So I just wanted to mention in spite of this, weird things do happen in very rare cases, and this could even be due to the fact that it's illegal and thus not manufactured with consistent/optimum purity. Both of my friends were quite experienced with dozens of enjoyable trips under their belt.
meri_dian 9y ago
Agreed. We should preserve the natural world if there are good reasons for doing so. I believe there are, not only for self preservation of the human species, but because of the joy so many feel being immersed in nature. Appeals to reason don't force us to bow to economic imperatives. Wanting to preserve nature for the joy it brings us is perfectly rational and reasonable.
ux4 9y ago
I think there are strong emotional anchors to environmentalism and all other political beliefs. You could provide a non-environmentalist with all the facts and rational arguments of why environmentalism is important, but you may never change their mind because they grew up a certain way and their belief on environmentalism is emotionally embedded. However, if they experienced the issue first hand or encountered some sort of emotionally-provoking insight (such as a psychedelic trip), they are more likely to reevaluate and change their core beliefs.

roceasta 9y ago

>one whole living system of which we're just cells It's a moving metaphor but of course cells within us have the same genome whereas different humans have different genomes. So it's hard to consider them part of one living system, unless one accepts the Gaia Hypothesis. The sense of oneness or of a divine essence permeating the whole of physical reality is caused by the fact that we don't perceive external entities directly. Rather we each of us perceive our own unified model of reality comprised of tokens for all entities including tokens representing external physical objects. And we may eventually become aware of this, giving rise to that sense. For some people this happens with the assistance of a hallucinogen which I think distorts the model enough for it to become noticeable as a model. Others have spontaneous spiritual experiences. None of which is to say that life isn't precious, or that consciousness is not a wonderful thing.

sapote 9y ago
> It's a moving metaphor but of course cells within us have the same genome whereas different humans have different genomes. So it's hard to consider them part of one living system, unless one accepts the Gaia Hypothesis. Except recent studies have found that even our own cells often have different DNA from each other (not just due to mutation), and that what makes us function is a careful dance of countless microbes.
mej10 9y ago
> So it's hard to consider them part of one living system You couldn't live without many other organisms both in you and around you.
- roceasta 9y ago
  That's true; there's cooperation everywhere and at every level. But there's competition too. There are of course many organisms that kill and maim others to make a living. So the divine unity that the mystics, poets and psychonauts speak of cannot derive from nature per se, as many people believe. In my comment I tried to give an alternate explanation.

dsnuh 9y ago

A little background - LSD was my first drug. I started when I was 13, before I ever had a drink of liquor, or a puff from a cigarette. I tripped probably 75 times between the ages of 13-23. I firmly believe the same. Every person (without known psychological conditions) should have a psychedelic experience at least once within their lifetime, ideally during the formative years of early adulthood. These are tools to investigate what it means to be a consciousness here on Earth. They allow people that otherwise may not (I am a staunch Atheist, for example) to experience the ineffable. That changes you, and in my experience, usually for the better. It shows you that you are just a tiny part of the system, and that you have this rare and special gift of existing as a conscious being, able to investigate your own mind and perceptions of reality. It shows you that there is no "outside" yourself. I do think that most people would do better to try psilocybin, as it has a more "earthy" connected-ness feel to it than LSD ever did for me. To me, LSD puts you into the place of an alien experience this planet for the first time, and psilocybin makes you feel at home in your place in the world. LSD is much more cerebral, while psilocybin is more about the connected-ness. Either are recommended for use at Disneyland, if you want to get the full experience of just how weird and wonderful this reality is. ;) edit: Try psilocybin _first_, then LSD if you enjoyed that. Psilocybin doesn't last nearly as long as an LSD experience, which can be easier in my experience than just jumping straight into the deep end of the pool.