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I don't understand the whole problem. If everyone who actually cared about it bought e.g. the S8 from Samsung instead, I'm sure Apple would get the message - a

I don't understand the whole problem. If everyone who actually cared about it bought e.g. the S8 from Samsung instead, I'm sure Apple would get the message - and bring it back. Since people are still buying it in droves it must not be a real clincher to most people. The S8+ has a great DAC (as tested on my range of Audio Technica headphones), still supports Bluetooth audio - latest spec, and is a fantastic phone overall, with a design far surpassing the headphone-less iPhone 7. IMO, Apple engineers have gotten lazy. They removed the port without adding value.

coldtea 9y ago
>IMO, Apple engineers have gotten lazy. They removed the port without adding value. Or you know, they have rather good reasons for it. Like better waterproofing (Samsung always fails behind iPhone in waterproof tests, and doesn't support fully even the nominal waterproof levels they say they do), thinner feature phones in the roadmap, smarter headphones, etc.
- DSMan195276 9y ago
  Mind giving a source for that claim? The S7 is IP68 rated, the iPhone 7 is only IP67. Are you saying those ratings are false?
  - pwinnski 9y ago
    I'll say it, and provide a source[0]. In that video, both phones are subjected to ever-increasing water depths until the S7 dies (very respectably) after five minutes at 35 feet, while the iPhone 7 continues to operate. That suggests to me that both phones probably should have been rated IP68. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K05cTPeFfyM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K05cTPeFfyM
    - NicoJuicy 9y ago
      Well, my iPhone fell into the water and it died too, just saying
    - DSMan195276 9y ago
      I think it's a bit hard to make that claim with only one test with only one phone each (And it's a little convenient that the only guy who found the iPhone 7 to be more water resistant is the guy named 'EverythingApplePro'). That said, while you may be right they should be rated the same, that doesn't really help OPs point. Even if they should be rated the same, the S7 has a headphone jack and the iPhone 7 doesn't. If the headphone jack is really the problem then the iPhone 7 should be way better at handling water then the S7, and yet even in the video you linked the iPhone 7 was suffering damage from the same depths the S7 did. I would argue that even if the video is legitimate it's entirely possible he just got a "lucky" iPhone 7 that didn't end-up getting fried from the little water that got in, and the S7 wasn't quite as lucky. From one test you really just can't know.
rusk 9y ago
> They removed the port without adding value They haven't added value for their customers but they will be reducing costs for the business going forward and are helping provide a platform for future revenue.
- sundvor 9y ago
  Yep, because that's exactly what Apple needs - they seem to be really struggling. /s :P
icantdrive55 9y ago
I like the Samsung. I just don't want spent more than $150 on a phone anymore. I'm not in either companies Demographics anymore? If Republic Wireless doesn't lower their rates to what they were a few years ago; they are going bye--bye too. Yea, they just rounded up plans, but it's the principle. In all honestly, I'm replusled by big expensive phones. Hell--I'm repulsed by big expensive anything these days.
croon 9y ago
> If everyone who actually cared about it bought e.g. the S8 from Samsung instead, I'm sure Apple would get the message - and bring it back. Since people are still buying it in droves it must not be a real clincher to most people. That's not a reasonable assumption. If they had manufactured an alternative iPhone 7 (that was thicker than the regular one, or whatever was their rationalizing for removing it) then we could say that anyone buying the alternative one was communicating their want/need of the jack. There is significant platform lock-in between iOS and Android, and while you can always switch, there are a lot more factors than the headphone jack, making it - without a gradient - impossible to draw any such conclusions from the data points available.
- Ntrails 9y ago
  > There is significant platform lock-in between iOS and Android I've had an iPhone since the 4, at first because it was the best phone by a long way imo. Now? I imagine switching and would rather pay the premium not to go through that hassle. I'm super sad that I'll have to use a shitty adapter to have semi decent ear buds (I use sennheiser cx-500 most of the time) - but again not enough to motivate switching. [I've not looked but assume Sennh don't make compatible headphones]
madeofpalk 9y ago
Remove it in the prior version to get all of that discussion over and done with. When the next iPhone comes out, there'll no longer be outrage about it missing a headphone jack. I own the 7S without the headphone jack and while most of the time I'm fine without it, there are a few instances (mostly on planes or long car) where it really pisses me off. But switching to an alternative device that has a headphone jack would piss me off even more due to other things. I look at it the same way about the removal of the physical home button from the iPhone 7S - 'train' users/press prior about the potential negatives so you can control more of the conversation when the 'next big phone' comes out that you want make sure makes a good, big impact.
- Accacin 9y ago
  I didn't think there was a 7S?
  - sbarre 9y ago
    He might mean 7 Plus?
  - madeofpalk 9y ago
    Apologies, I meant the 7.
- endemic 9y ago
  > Remove it in the prior version to get all of that discussion over and done with. When the next iPhone comes out, there'll no longer be outrage about it missing a headphone jack. Seems reasonable, but if the next iPhone is the massive redesign everyone is expecting, wouldn't have been easier to remove the jack and play it off as a requirement of the new design? "This is the iPhone of the future," etc.
  - sbarre 9y ago
    Those were going to be controversial design changes no matter what so, like others have rightly pointed out, do them incrementally to allow all the discussion and annoyance/outrage to pass and not dominate the conversation in the media (both social and professional).
jpalomaki 9y ago
Problem is same as with Thinkpads. Many People love their iPhone. They want to have iPhone and don't want to be stuck on Samsung for many years on just to send message to Apple.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

coldtea 9y ago

>IMO, Apple engineers have gotten lazy. They removed the port without adding value. Or you know, they have rather good reasons for it. Like better waterproofing (Samsung always fails behind iPhone in waterproof tests, and doesn't support fully even the nominal waterproof levels they say they do), thinner feature phones in the roadmap, smarter headphones, etc.

DSMan195276 9y ago
Mind giving a source for that claim? The S7 is IP68 rated, the iPhone 7 is only IP67. Are you saying those ratings are false?
- pwinnski 9y ago
  I'll say it, and provide a source[0]. In that video, both phones are subjected to ever-increasing water depths until the S7 dies (very respectably) after five minutes at 35 feet, while the iPhone 7 continues to operate. That suggests to me that both phones probably should have been rated IP68. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K05cTPeFfyM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K05cTPeFfyM
  - NicoJuicy 9y ago
    Well, my iPhone fell into the water and it died too, just saying
  - DSMan195276 9y ago
    I think it's a bit hard to make that claim with only one test with only one phone each (And it's a little convenient that the only guy who found the iPhone 7 to be more water resistant is the guy named 'EverythingApplePro'). That said, while you may be right they should be rated the same, that doesn't really help OPs point. Even if they should be rated the same, the S7 has a headphone jack and the iPhone 7 doesn't. If the headphone jack is really the problem then the iPhone 7 should be way better at handling water then the S7, and yet even in the video you linked the iPhone 7 was suffering damage from the same depths the S7 did. I would argue that even if the video is legitimate it's entirely possible he just got a "lucky" iPhone 7 that didn't end-up getting fried from the little water that got in, and the S7 wasn't quite as lucky. From one test you really just can't know.

rusk 9y ago

> They removed the port without adding value They haven't added value for their customers but they will be reducing costs for the business going forward and are helping provide a platform for future revenue.

sundvor 9y ago
Yep, because that's exactly what Apple needs - they seem to be really struggling. /s :P

icantdrive55 9y ago

I like the Samsung. I just don't want spent more than $150 on a phone anymore. I'm not in either companies Demographics anymore? If Republic Wireless doesn't lower their rates to what they were a few years ago; they are going bye--bye too. Yea, they just rounded up plans, but it's the principle. In all honestly, I'm replusled by big expensive phones. Hell--I'm repulsed by big expensive anything these days.

croon 9y ago

> If everyone who actually cared about it bought e.g. the S8 from Samsung instead, I'm sure Apple would get the message - and bring it back. Since people are still buying it in droves it must not be a real clincher to most people. That's not a reasonable assumption. If they had manufactured an alternative iPhone 7 (that was thicker than the regular one, or whatever was their rationalizing for removing it) then we could say that anyone buying the alternative one was communicating their want/need of the jack. There is significant platform lock-in between iOS and Android, and while you can always switch, there are a lot more factors than the headphone jack, making it - without a gradient - impossible to draw any such conclusions from the data points available.

Ntrails 9y ago
> There is significant platform lock-in between iOS and Android I've had an iPhone since the 4, at first because it was the best phone by a long way imo. Now? I imagine switching and would rather pay the premium not to go through that hassle. I'm super sad that I'll have to use a shitty adapter to have semi decent ear buds (I use sennheiser cx-500 most of the time) - but again not enough to motivate switching. [I've not looked but assume Sennh don't make compatible headphones]

madeofpalk 9y ago

Remove it in the prior version to get all of that discussion over and done with. When the next iPhone comes out, there'll no longer be outrage about it missing a headphone jack. I own the 7S without the headphone jack and while most of the time I'm fine without it, there are a few instances (mostly on planes or long car) where it really pisses me off. But switching to an alternative device that has a headphone jack would piss me off even more due to other things. I look at it the same way about the removal of the physical home button from the iPhone 7S - 'train' users/press prior about the potential negatives so you can control more of the conversation when the 'next big phone' comes out that you want make sure makes a good, big impact.

Accacin 9y ago
I didn't think there was a 7S?
- sbarre 9y ago
  He might mean 7 Plus?
- madeofpalk 9y ago
  Apologies, I meant the 7.
endemic 9y ago
> Remove it in the prior version to get all of that discussion over and done with. When the next iPhone comes out, there'll no longer be outrage about it missing a headphone jack. Seems reasonable, but if the next iPhone is the massive redesign everyone is expecting, wouldn't have been easier to remove the jack and play it off as a requirement of the new design? "This is the iPhone of the future," etc.
- sbarre 9y ago
  Those were going to be controversial design changes no matter what so, like others have rightly pointed out, do them incrementally to allow all the discussion and annoyance/outrage to pass and not dominate the conversation in the media (both social and professional).

jpalomaki 9y ago

Problem is same as with Thinkpads. Many People love their iPhone. They want to have iPhone and don't want to be stuck on Samsung for many years on just to send message to Apple.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]