4 ms·

There was an interesting City Journal article about fishermen getting in the mix that caught me by surprise in an interested party that never occurred to me bef

There was an interesting City Journal article about fishermen getting in the mix that caught me by surprise in an interested party that never occurred to me before. City Journal has good historical background and context that they gather up on subjects too... "The mounting opposition to the development of offshore wind in Long Island’s waters is the latest example of the growing conflict between renewable-energy promoters and rural residents. Cuomo and climate-change activists love the idea of wind energy, but they’re not the ones having 500-, 600-, or even 700-foot-high wind turbines built in their neighborhoods or on top of their prime fishing spots. The backlash against Big Wind is evident in the numbers: since 2015, about 160 government entities, from Maine to California, have rejected or restricted wind projects. One recent example: on May 2, voters in three Michigan counties went to the polls to vote on wind-related ballot initiatives. Big Wind lost on every initiative." https://www.city-journal.org/html/bonackers-vs-big-wind-15333.html https://www.city-journal.org/html/bonackers-vs-big-wind-1533...

notatoad 9y ago
"'Not even Superman standing on Montauk Point could see these wind farms,' he said. Maybe not; and maybe wealthy beachfront homeowners won’t be able to see the proposed turbines, but lots of fishermen will. And that has them spoiling for a fight." seriously? Why on earth does it matter if fishermen see wind farms? when did we invent the rule that all energy generation needs to be invisible?
- yuliyp 9y ago
  The point is that they fear that fish will be scared away from the area by the presence of the turbines.
  - notatoad 9y ago
    Is there any evidence to suggest that's the case though? A quick google suggests the opposite to be true. [1] This reminds me of the middle-america folks who were claiming the wind turbines near their houses caused all kinds of disease, including somebody who claimed the wind turbines were causing people to contract aids. Not sure if it's just an unfounded fear of new things, or if it's a concerted effort by the fossil fuel lobby, but people really like to hate wind power. [1] http://www.aqua.dtu.dk/english/News/2012/04/120410_Fish-thriving-around-wind-farms http://www.aqua.dtu.dk/english/News/2012/04/120410_Fish-thri...
    - wbillingsley 9y ago
      If you're not keen on a big noisy ugly thing near your house, then the unspecified-risks-to-health card looks like handy one to play.. As I understand it, it's predominantly the noise that annoys people (At 110db up close, a turbine is equivalent to a propeller aircraft on taxi, and while most people hear the local town airport when the wind is in the right/wrong direction and/or there's a temperature inversion making the sound carry, those aircraft take off and are gone, while a turbine just keeps droning all day). ~60db has occasionally been measured near housing, and that's loud enough you'd have to raise your voice to talk -- not what people move to the countryside for, and as it's hard to get rid of a turbine after it's built they'll fight tooth and claw to stop it being built anywhere near them.
      - oblio 9y ago
        I think we're talking about offshore turbines. Who can hear 110 db from 30 km away? :)
        dsfyu404ed 9y ago
        The Navy could take a census of whale populations by having sonar operators listen for whale farts. Sound travels really far over water but even farther in water. The ocean is obviously a very noisy place but the long term environmental affects of what's essentially a white noise machine are yet to be known.
        jxramos 9y ago
        lol, that's quite the sampling technique. Whatever works right? Must be a pretty characteristic sound, but what a job right. "What do you do for work?" "I analyze waveforms for whale flatulence"
        wbillingsley 9y ago
        The one I was replying to was talking about objectors in the mid-west. Not much ocean in Iowa :)
- jxramos 9y ago
  I figured it was a simple matter of navigation and not crashing into these monstrous obstacles. I could even imagine it becoming a slalom sport of some kind if the danger was not too high risk. Something along those lines. Should be interesting to see the optimum grid layout for these things and how that scale of spacing compares relative to the average length of a fishing trawler.

notatoad 9y ago

"'Not even Superman standing on Montauk Point could see these wind farms,' he said. Maybe not; and maybe wealthy beachfront homeowners won’t be able to see the proposed turbines, but lots of fishermen will. And that has them spoiling for a fight." seriously? Why on earth does it matter if fishermen see wind farms? when did we invent the rule that all energy generation needs to be invisible?

yuliyp 9y ago
The point is that they fear that fish will be scared away from the area by the presence of the turbines.
- notatoad 9y ago
  Is there any evidence to suggest that's the case though? A quick google suggests the opposite to be true. [1] This reminds me of the middle-america folks who were claiming the wind turbines near their houses caused all kinds of disease, including somebody who claimed the wind turbines were causing people to contract aids. Not sure if it's just an unfounded fear of new things, or if it's a concerted effort by the fossil fuel lobby, but people really like to hate wind power. [1] http://www.aqua.dtu.dk/english/News/2012/04/120410_Fish-thriving-around-wind-farms http://www.aqua.dtu.dk/english/News/2012/04/120410_Fish-thri...
  - wbillingsley 9y ago
    If you're not keen on a big noisy ugly thing near your house, then the unspecified-risks-to-health card looks like handy one to play.. As I understand it, it's predominantly the noise that annoys people (At 110db up close, a turbine is equivalent to a propeller aircraft on taxi, and while most people hear the local town airport when the wind is in the right/wrong direction and/or there's a temperature inversion making the sound carry, those aircraft take off and are gone, while a turbine just keeps droning all day). ~60db has occasionally been measured near housing, and that's loud enough you'd have to raise your voice to talk -- not what people move to the countryside for, and as it's hard to get rid of a turbine after it's built they'll fight tooth and claw to stop it being built anywhere near them.
    - oblio 9y ago
      I think we're talking about offshore turbines. Who can hear 110 db from 30 km away? :)
      - dsfyu404ed 9y ago
        The Navy could take a census of whale populations by having sonar operators listen for whale farts. Sound travels really far over water but even farther in water. The ocean is obviously a very noisy place but the long term environmental affects of what's essentially a white noise machine are yet to be known.
        jxramos 9y ago
        lol, that's quite the sampling technique. Whatever works right? Must be a pretty characteristic sound, but what a job right. "What do you do for work?" "I analyze waveforms for whale flatulence"
      - wbillingsley 9y ago
        The one I was replying to was talking about objectors in the mid-west. Not much ocean in Iowa :)
jxramos 9y ago
I figured it was a simple matter of navigation and not crashing into these monstrous obstacles. I could even imagine it becoming a slalom sport of some kind if the danger was not too high risk. Something along those lines. Should be interesting to see the optimum grid layout for these things and how that scale of spacing compares relative to the average length of a fishing trawler.