5 ms·

>* cold calling alone can create and be a business in its own right - because cold calling is effectively the ability to make things happen - whereas every oth

by lsc 16y ago

>* cold calling alone can create and be a business in its own right - because cold calling is effectively the ability to make things happen - whereas every other business activity needs cold calling to start up and survive Huh. even if you expand cold calling to include all 'approach someone to ask for a sale' this is plainly untrue, especially after the advent of the Internet. I don't think I've cold-approached even one customer. And really, my business model simply wouldn't work if i had to. with my margins, paying even a mediocre salesguy a commission would eat me alive. Actually, this is everything I don't understand about sales. What sort of person responds to a cold approach, when it is almost always the case that you can get a better deal (either a lower price, /or/ something that better meets your needs, sometimes both) going out and searching for something on your own? Are you targeting people who don't care about price only?

j_b_f 16y ago
Everything is dependent on your market. To paraphrase Dharmesh Shah, "enterprise products are sold, not bought." Part of that selling process is making sure prospects know you exist, and understand the value you provide. Cold calls are one way to do that. Not a very cost effective (or effective) way to do it, but still one way. Personal example: today I got a cold call from a guy who runs a shop that produces short video interviews with companies and their customers. Their product looks awesome, but they're so small and I new I probably would have never found them otherwise. We'll probably use them. On the other hand, if we do it, that'll be the second cold-call product I will have purchased in 10 years running this business.
- lsc 16y ago
  my biggest issue was his "all businesses depend upon cold calling" statement, which is simply not true. But yeah, in your case, that sounds like a company I might buy services from... but I wouldn't respond to a 'cold call' at least not via phone, just 'cause I find that so offensive. (I might respond if the sales pitch was soft, and it was pitched in a semi-social place. A "oh, and what do you do?" at a local hangout, sure, i might buy from that, if I thought that the method of sales wasn't adding significantly to what I'd pay (which is to say, if the product wasn't available from a 'price on the website is what you pay' type vendor.)
edkennedy 16y ago
I think a lot of people get caught up in the word 'cold', however what's most interesting about calling potential clients is the warm part of human nature and emotion. These elements of a sales pitch are learned in the form of raw feedback with the client on the phone. You can learn a great deal about human nature talking to people and selling them things. As a matter of fact I find that learning human psychology from books, or basing decisions purely off of numbers to be the 'cold' method. I think that the article itself is pointing out that cold calling is useful not simply for sales, but many other areas that will benefit your business. For example, strategic business partnerships, advertisers, public relations and surveying your customer base. In my experience cold calling, the people who only care about price are the tough nuts to crack. They usually ask the question within the first call as a 'time saver' and this can usually be side stepped with a qualifying question. Some sales people even think that these types of clients are not worth time spent on them, but I think handling the price objection is essential to progressing in your skill as a sales person. A few of the types of clients that prospecting uncovers that buy are clients who have a genuine need (easy to sell, sometimes hard to service), information gathering 'tire kickers' who are converted with the benefits, and personable people who prefer service to price that are converted to a sale with personal touches.
silverlake 16y ago
> going out and searching for something on your own Shockingly, many big companies don't search for products/services they need. They muddle along doing the same thing for 10 years completely unaware that things have changed. The best way to inform them that you've got something that might help them is cold calling or targeted advertising. It's depressing but true.
dpatru 16y ago
Selling is helping prospects understand how your product can benefit them. It's teaching the lesson of the benefits of an innovation. If the innovation/lesson is simply a lower price for an existing product, it is not hard to understand, so the selling/teaching is easy and therefore not very lucrative. Where the innovation/lesson is a new way of doing business, the selling/teaching is harder and therefore more lucrative. > Actually, this is everything I don't understand about sales. What sort of person responds to a cold approach, when it is almost always the case that you can get a better deal (either a lower price, /or/ something that better meets your needs, sometimes both) going out and searching for something on your own? The most lucrative selling/teaching is where the lesson is complicated. The salesperson of tractors to farmers currently using oxen will make more money selling than a seller of a commodity. If you know what you need and just want the best price, then you don't need a high-priced salesman/teacher to educate you. All you need to learn is the price. I suspect that the reason you don't understand selling is that you do most of your learning on your own. Once you've decided what to buy, you then shop for the lowest price. You don't deal much with salespeople who are teaching you. If you did less learning on your own, then you would appreciate salespeople more. The best-paid salespeople deal with prospects who don't know what they need and need to be educated. (Interestingly, these people tend to work in big corporations.) This is from the same site, different page (http://www.bu http://www.bu sinessballs.com/salestraining.htm#theproductoffer): Moreover the few customers who recognise the product benefit by its features and advantages will also recognise all the competitors' products too, which will cause all the sales people selling features and advantages to converge on the most astute purchasing group, leaving the most lucrative uninformed prospects largely untouched.
- lsc 16y ago
  >I suspect that the reason you don't understand selling is that you do most of your learning on your own. Once you've decided what to buy, you then shop for the lowest price. I believe this is true. the part I'm still missing is this: how can a person trust your average salesperson as a teacher? I mean, most salespeople /openly snipe/ the competition, which in my mind brings laser focus on their bias. Also, I've never met a salesperson who knew as much as I do about hardware. It's pretty rare that I meet one who knows as much as i did when I was 14. I mean obviously, most of the time the sales person is talking to someone who doesn't know as much. But even so, when the guy is openly slagging the competition, even if you don't know anything about the actual product, wouldn't that make you just a little bit suspicious that the guy isn't working in your best interests? Now, most of my salesguy experiences have been evaluating 'enterprise' products for companies I've worked or consulted for... when my company needs something, like you said, we figure out what it is we need on our own, then we call up the vendors involved (if it's the sort of product you can get a better deal calling in that buying from newegg or provantage) and figure out who has the lowest price. Now, sometimes we have a hard time getting people to talk to us, but especially if we have done business before, it's usually pretty quick and painless for both sides. the only real problem arises when it's a good that I don't know the approximate price range... I mean, I really only need a 2ghz chip, but if it's only another twenty bucks, i'll take the 2.2ghz... so if the part doesn't have enough public data for me to know about the price, I do waste some of their time trying to figure out the optimal price point. But when I am experiencing real salesmanship, when, say, I'm evaluating two big-name brands of blade servers for a client[1] it seems like it's almost a battle between the sales folks trying to obfuscate facts and trick my client into acting against their interest, and me, trying to prove to my client that commodity hardware is commodity, and that when buying commodity hardware, you need to look at what is inside the box rather than the name on front. All the while the salesguys are handing out $50 amazon or starbucks gift certificates, or expensive booze to everyone they can get their hands on. I think the blade salesmen, after giving us all gift certs gave my boss a bottle of remmy; an unrelated sales team left a couple cases of beer in the ops room for us to share. Over and over, I found the salespeople in blatant lies. Now, i don't know if they knew they were lying ahead of time, or if they didn't know, and they were just making things up that may or may not be true that might get the customer to buy. At one point they claimed that the 2.5" sas drives performed better than the 3.5" drives in most cases. I obtained datasheets from the manufactures in question, and was able to show the boss that the opposite was, in fact, true. I guess my point is that the sales people knew very little about the products in question, and they were lying in obvious ways about the things they did know about. [1]if you care, they are basically the same hardware, and the generation I was looking at was garbage because they used FBDIMMs. with the ram load my customer bought, a 1u pizza box with the same xeon CPU but with registered ecc ddr2 and the low power chipset used almost half as much power, and costs way less up front. Of course this was a few years back and all the hardware we evaluated is now thoroughly obsolete. None the less, blade servers do not always save you power.

by lsc 16y ago

j_b_f 16y ago

Everything is dependent on your market. To paraphrase Dharmesh Shah, "enterprise products are sold, not bought." Part of that selling process is making sure prospects know you exist, and understand the value you provide. Cold calls are one way to do that. Not a very cost effective (or effective) way to do it, but still one way. Personal example: today I got a cold call from a guy who runs a shop that produces short video interviews with companies and their customers. Their product looks awesome, but they're so small and I new I probably would have never found them otherwise. We'll probably use them. On the other hand, if we do it, that'll be the second cold-call product I will have purchased in 10 years running this business.

lsc 16y ago
my biggest issue was his "all businesses depend upon cold calling" statement, which is simply not true. But yeah, in your case, that sounds like a company I might buy services from... but I wouldn't respond to a 'cold call' at least not via phone, just 'cause I find that so offensive. (I might respond if the sales pitch was soft, and it was pitched in a semi-social place. A "oh, and what do you do?" at a local hangout, sure, i might buy from that, if I thought that the method of sales wasn't adding significantly to what I'd pay (which is to say, if the product wasn't available from a 'price on the website is what you pay' type vendor.)

edkennedy 16y ago

I think a lot of people get caught up in the word 'cold', however what's most interesting about calling potential clients is the warm part of human nature and emotion. These elements of a sales pitch are learned in the form of raw feedback with the client on the phone. You can learn a great deal about human nature talking to people and selling them things. As a matter of fact I find that learning human psychology from books, or basing decisions purely off of numbers to be the 'cold' method. I think that the article itself is pointing out that cold calling is useful not simply for sales, but many other areas that will benefit your business. For example, strategic business partnerships, advertisers, public relations and surveying your customer base. In my experience cold calling, the people who only care about price are the tough nuts to crack. They usually ask the question within the first call as a 'time saver' and this can usually be side stepped with a qualifying question. Some sales people even think that these types of clients are not worth time spent on them, but I think handling the price objection is essential to progressing in your skill as a sales person. A few of the types of clients that prospecting uncovers that buy are clients who have a genuine need (easy to sell, sometimes hard to service), information gathering 'tire kickers' who are converted with the benefits, and personable people who prefer service to price that are converted to a sale with personal touches.

silverlake 16y ago

> going out and searching for something on your own Shockingly, many big companies don't search for products/services they need. They muddle along doing the same thing for 10 years completely unaware that things have changed. The best way to inform them that you've got something that might help them is cold calling or targeted advertising. It's depressing but true.

dpatru 16y ago

Selling is helping prospects understand how your product can benefit them. It's teaching the lesson of the benefits of an innovation. If the innovation/lesson is simply a lower price for an existing product, it is not hard to understand, so the selling/teaching is easy and therefore not very lucrative. Where the innovation/lesson is a new way of doing business, the selling/teaching is harder and therefore more lucrative. > Actually, this is everything I don't understand about sales. What sort of person responds to a cold approach, when it is almost always the case that you can get a better deal (either a lower price, /or/ something that better meets your needs, sometimes both) going out and searching for something on your own? The most lucrative selling/teaching is where the lesson is complicated. The salesperson of tractors to farmers currently using oxen will make more money selling than a seller of a commodity. If you know what you need and just want the best price, then you don't need a high-priced salesman/teacher to educate you. All you need to learn is the price. I suspect that the reason you don't understand selling is that you do most of your learning on your own. Once you've decided what to buy, you then shop for the lowest price. You don't deal much with salespeople who are teaching you. If you did less learning on your own, then you would appreciate salespeople more. The best-paid salespeople deal with prospects who don't know what they need and need to be educated. (Interestingly, these people tend to work in big corporations.) This is from the same site, different page (http://www.bu http://www.bu sinessballs.com/salestraining.htm#theproductoffer): Moreover the few customers who recognise the product benefit by its features and advantages will also recognise all the competitors' products too, which will cause all the sales people selling features and advantages to converge on the most astute purchasing group, leaving the most lucrative uninformed prospects largely untouched.

lsc 16y ago
>I suspect that the reason you don't understand selling is that you do most of your learning on your own. Once you've decided what to buy, you then shop for the lowest price. I believe this is true. the part I'm still missing is this: how can a person trust your average salesperson as a teacher? I mean, most salespeople /openly snipe/ the competition, which in my mind brings laser focus on their bias. Also, I've never met a salesperson who knew as much as I do about hardware. It's pretty rare that I meet one who knows as much as i did when I was 14. I mean obviously, most of the time the sales person is talking to someone who doesn't know as much. But even so, when the guy is openly slagging the competition, even if you don't know anything about the actual product, wouldn't that make you just a little bit suspicious that the guy isn't working in your best interests? Now, most of my salesguy experiences have been evaluating 'enterprise' products for companies I've worked or consulted for... when my company needs something, like you said, we figure out what it is we need on our own, then we call up the vendors involved (if it's the sort of product you can get a better deal calling in that buying from newegg or provantage) and figure out who has the lowest price. Now, sometimes we have a hard time getting people to talk to us, but especially if we have done business before, it's usually pretty quick and painless for both sides. the only real problem arises when it's a good that I don't know the approximate price range... I mean, I really only need a 2ghz chip, but if it's only another twenty bucks, i'll take the 2.2ghz... so if the part doesn't have enough public data for me to know about the price, I do waste some of their time trying to figure out the optimal price point. But when I am experiencing real salesmanship, when, say, I'm evaluating two big-name brands of blade servers for a client[1] it seems like it's almost a battle between the sales folks trying to obfuscate facts and trick my client into acting against their interest, and me, trying to prove to my client that commodity hardware is commodity, and that when buying commodity hardware, you need to look at what is inside the box rather than the name on front. All the while the salesguys are handing out $50 amazon or starbucks gift certificates, or expensive booze to everyone they can get their hands on. I think the blade salesmen, after giving us all gift certs gave my boss a bottle of remmy; an unrelated sales team left a couple cases of beer in the ops room for us to share. Over and over, I found the salespeople in blatant lies. Now, i don't know if they knew they were lying ahead of time, or if they didn't know, and they were just making things up that may or may not be true that might get the customer to buy. At one point they claimed that the 2.5" sas drives performed better than the 3.5" drives in most cases. I obtained datasheets from the manufactures in question, and was able to show the boss that the opposite was, in fact, true. I guess my point is that the sales people knew very little about the products in question, and they were lying in obvious ways about the things they did know about. [1]if you care, they are basically the same hardware, and the generation I was looking at was garbage because they used FBDIMMs. with the ram load my customer bought, a 1u pizza box with the same xeon CPU but with registered ecc ddr2 and the low power chipset used almost half as much power, and costs way less up front. Of course this was a few years back and all the hardware we evaluated is now thoroughly obsolete. None the less, blade servers do not always save you power.